Carrera 3.0 market watch

[Roy]

There's been some recent market watch threads started for the 928 and 924, so I thought I'd start one for the Carrera 3.0.

To kick it off, here's one that's on Carsales (no affiliation). And some commentary around the Carrera 3.0 to go with it...

 https://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Porsche-911-Carrera-1977/SSE-AD-4393612/?Cr=4

There has been a fair bit of debate around the value of the Carrera 3.0 Vs the SC - notably whenever a Carrera 3.0 is posted in the "What's For Sale..." thread. The question that's generally asked is; “Why would the Carrera 3.0 be worth more than the SC, they are basically the same car.”

They're not. And there is some credible commentary to state otherwise.

In the upcoming Total 911 issue (not released yet), there is an article that puts the Carrera 3.0 against the Carrera 2.7 mfi. The Carrera 3.0 does pretty well, though, most experts will agree the 2.7 is a more desirable car in many ways.

However (and to the point), the article also points out that the Carrera 3.0 is often confused with the SC, and goes on to explain why they are not the same. They both have 3 litre engines. They both have a G-series body. But they’re different. The engines are different, the Carrera 3.0 is also lighter than the SC.

While rarity alone separates the value and global desirability of these two cars (only a few thousand Carrera 3.0 were made, obviously less in RHD, while the SC was high volume for the time), at least there is a recently written article that touches on the differences.

Here are a couple of excerpts from the article (I couldn’t upload an image of the upcoming article as it was too big):

 

…This is far from being a bad car and indeed, it’s sad to consider that the Carrera 3.0 is often confused with the 3.0-litre SC.

The Carrera 3.0 is surprising. Still lightweight and still developing 200hp, it’s often confused with the blunted SC that followed and is a great drive. The throttle isn’t quite as snappy (as the C2.7MFI), but it’s far from dull, with the bosh K-Jetronic injection bringing in the power slightly lower down…

 

…This was my first real drive of a Carrera 3.0. Above all, I’m finding myself surprised at the mid-range surge from the engine. The default setting when discussing 3.0 911’s is that they lack the torque of the 3.2. I’ve driven many 3.0 SC’s and now it’s very easy to see why Porsche owners of the time were underwhelmed by the car. If you had traded your Carrera 3.0 or 2.7 MFI for an SC in 1978, you would certainly have regrets…

 

…One final thought. Just imagine what might have happened to the 911 had Porsche not built the 2.7 MFI and the Carrera 3.0. As the fathers of the homologation special 3.0 RS and subsequently the 930 Turbo, the 911 landscape would look very different today had Porsche’s management lost courage and either of these two had not been born. (Total) 911.

 

[GusTV]

What happened to that German delivered (RHD converted from LHD) metallic green carrera 3.0? Think it last appeared at the Autoclassica auction but did not sell? Was a great looking car and owned by a forum member I think.

[symsy]

What happened to that German delivered (RHD converted from LHD) metallic green carrera 3.0? Think it last appeared at the Autoclassica auction but did not sell? Was a great looking car and owned by a forum member I think.

Yes a great car .. saw that one . Painted well and lots of other stuff.. Sold cheaply I understand for other opportunities.. So bargains are out there 

Personaly I thought it was a great period colour. Im a white fanatic through and through with my cars..but I think with these retro cars that green was a good statement

[James P]

Sold my C3 recently to a guy in LA, he has a 2.7mfi also.. the demand for good collectible Carreras is always going to be strong. I've driven most 911's  made but not the 2.7mfi so I can't compare them. The C3 is by far the best older 911 I've driven 

[Pedro]

I own both an SC and C3. A nice clean SC is a very cool car, and I love mine a lot (and actually prefer it over 3.2), but the C3 is in a different ballpark. What's not to like - rare, cracking engine, light and raw. 100 coupes came into Australia, who knows how many are left intact. Mine are going to my kids. 

[JLD]

I own both an SC and C3. A nice clean SC is a very cool car, and I love mine a lot (and actually prefer it over 3.2), but the C3 is in a different ballpark. What's not to like - rare, cracking engine, light and raw. 100 coupes came into Australia, who knows how many are left intact. Mine are going to my kids. 

Father? Is that you?

[red clubbie]

Can someone educate me here.....what is the difference, driving wise between the C3 and the SC?

 

Cheers,

Geoff.

[Peter M]

Oh, Geoff, can't wait to hear the answers to that question!

Also look forward to the SC owners right of reply. 

 

 

 

Anyone who who uses the terms visceral, cerebral or rarefied deserves to be called a wanker.

Edited 5January, 2017 by Peter M
New Years resolution to call out dickheads

[sandy468]

Can someone educate me here.....what is the difference, driving wise between the C3 and the SC?

 

Cheers,

Geoff.

Heeeere we gooo ...

[Skidmarks]

Sold my C3 recently to a guy in LA, he has a 2.7mfi also.. the demand for good collectible Carreras is always going to be strong. I've driven most 911's  made but not the 2.7mfi so I can't compare them. The C3 is by far the best older 911 I've driven 

I'm lucky enough to have an example of each.  The Carrera 2.7 MFI is a bit better on the throttle and sounds more "mechanical" but the C3 has about the same output and is a little smoother. Chassis wise, there's absolutely no difference.  In my view, the C3 build numbers are on par with the 74/75 Carrera MFI to about the same in the "rarity" stakes.

In my book, the Carrera 3.0 at current prices is a bargain and were I not already on death row with my wife in light of recent acquisitions, I'd be buying whatever I could get and holding as well as enjoying taking them for the odd thrash.

Just my 2 cents worth 

Edited 5January, 2017 by Skidmarks

[Roy]

I'm lucky enough to have an example of each.  The Carrera 2.7 MFI is a bit better on the throttle and sounds more "mechanical" but the C3 has about the same output and is a little smoother. Chassis wise, there's absolutely no difference.  In my view, the C3 build numbers are on par with the 74/75 Carrera MFI to about the same in the "rarity" stakes.

In my book, the Carrera 3.0 at current prices is a bargain and were I not already being on death row with my wife in light of recent acquisitions, I'd be buying whatever I could get and holding as well as enjoying taking them for the odd thrash.

Just my 2 cents worth 

I've never driven a Carrera 2.7 (I have however briefly driven a 73 Carrera RS - bucket list item ticked : ) : ) so it's great to get a point of view from someone who has.

As a few have asked above (and assuming you've driven an SC), what's your view on the C3.0 Vs SC drive differences?

[Skidmarks]

I've never driven a Carrera 2.7 (I have however briefly driven a 73 Carrera RS - bucket list item ticked : ) : ) so it's great to get a point of view from someone who has.

As a few have asked above (and assuming you've driven an SC), what's your view on the C3.0 Vs SC drive differences?

I've not driven an SC other than a heavily modded club car a few years back so not able to say unfortunately. 

[Airhead]

 were I not already on death row with my wife in light of recent acquisitions, I'd be buying whatever I could get and holding as well as enjoying taking them for the odd thrash.

 

Don't tell her.

[LeeM]

Don't tell her.

  So Jono's incognito name on here is  Airhead?  

 Nice work mate

[Peter M]

Let's start with some tangibles.  There is no doubt I'd like a c3.o but sometimes I think we overstate the difference with the SC's and maybe forget the c3.o feels more powerful due to the cam giving a softer mid-range. (I admit I haven't compared the different cam grinds to confirm this assertion.) 

Using Porsche data

76' Carrera 3.o

Compression ratio - 8.5:1

200hp at 6000rpm

255Nm at 4200rpm

1120kg

>230kph

0 to 100kph - 6.5 seconds

0 to 1km - 27 seconds

81' SC

Compression ratio - 9.8:1

204hp at 5900rpm

267Nm at 4300rpm

1160kg 

235kph

0 to 100kph - 6.8 seconds

0 to 1km - 26.8 seconds

 

So definitely not chalk and cheese objectively but I don't underestimate the different feel of the lighter crank and peakier cam timing on making it feel "faster" and more exhilarating.

[Skidmarks]

Don't tell her.

Did that already. A few times ... she's a tolerant woman. 

[sandy468]

Let's start with some tangibles.  There is no doubt I'd like a c3.o but sometimes I think we overstate the difference with the SC's and maybe forget the c3.o feels more powerful due to the cam giving a softer mid-range. (I admit I haven't compared the different cam grinds to confirm this assertion.) 

Using Porsche data

76' Carrera 3.o

Compression ratio - 8.5:1

200hp at 6000rpm

255Nm at 4200rpm

1120kg

>230kph

0 to 100kph - 6.5 seconds

0 to 1km - 27 seconds

81' SC

Compression ratio - 9.8:1

204hp at 5900rpm

267Nm at 4300rpm

1160kg 

235kph

0 to 100kph - 6.8 seconds

0 to 1km - 26.8 seconds

 

So definitely not chalk and cheese objectively but I don't underestimate the different feel of the lighter crank and peakier cam timing on making it feel "faster" and more exhilarating.

Left out the weight component, would like to see that comparison

[James P]

Can someone educate me here.....what is the difference, driving wise between the C3 and the SC?

 

Cheers,

Geoff.

definitely chalk & cheese in my experience & I've a few SC's & a C3 

[OZ930]

So what would an all original Australian delivered, non sunroof, C3.0. daily driver with 200,000 km and patina to match be worth ?

[James P]

So what would an all original Australian delivered, non sunroof, C3.0. daily driver with 200,000 km and patina to match be worth ?

don't know... you selling I'm interested?

[OZ930]

don't know... you selling I'm interested?

Don't got….but know of

and not tellin

[James P]

Don't got….but know of

and not tellin

no fun in that 

[Pedro]

So what would an all original Australian delivered, non sunroof, C3.0. daily driver with 200,000 km and patina to match be worth ?

76 or 77, and colour? 

[michel]

What happened to that German delivered (RHD converted from LHD) metallic green carrera 3.0? Think it last appeared at the Autoclassica auction but did not sell? Was a great looking car and owned by a forum member I think.

ask Dave Belford...

Why it never sold at classica will remain a mystery ...though with only 13? of 43 sold not a good showing.

Drove it (green car) joyously over 4 days, when I was in brissie.

Cracker car and the C3 is a carrera, so demand can/should/must only remain  - James P's, car been an example that bucked the trend and went to the US

Funnily in the states most most have no idea and think they are an SC.

If 100 odd coupes oz delivered, what's the head count, already at 3 owners in this thread.

Of the delivered how many held by forum members?

 

 

Edited 5January, 2017 by michel

[Peter M]

Left out the weight component, would like to see that comparison

Sandy,

They're the numbers above suffixed with a "k" and a "g".