Coastr Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 Street cred for the non-car types. Call it non-cred if that makes sense. Us car types don't really understand, but there are plenty of people who don't buy bmws and mercs and Porsches but they have the money to. These people are going for Teslas in big numbers. they are selling every one they can make. Just talked to someone who is selling a 12 mo old 3 series for a model 3. 3 month wait list. the stuff about musk is just fake news. Head butted a car - yeah right. Don't know why he became a public enemy. He probably liked a trump tweet or something and became a non-person. An interesting page...they are estimating 4,700 per week. So a 3 month wait at 4,700 cars per week...another 60,000 cars produced before the guy I know gets his car. Thats why I think they are going to succeed at this. https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2018-tesla-tracker/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 Won’t be long before the look at me set are changing their EV more often than their phones. Depreciation be dammed after all they can virtue signal at mostly the poor’s expense. Model 3s are easy to sell as production numbers are abysmal and no where near what is required to keep up with the supply of gullible virtue signalers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 8September, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 What is the half-life of a new Tesla? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 Two battery types available but if the car is properly maintained Tesla claim Model 3 will retain 70 percent battery capacity after 120,000 miles (long-range battery) and 100,000 miles (shorter-range battery) So over 300,000 miles is possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 1 hour ago, Raven said: So over 300,000 miles is possible I love up to figures and quotes. As up to includes 0 and everything in between. An EV at 70% of original range is back in the land of toy cars and probably no longer fit for purpose and who would buy one with only 50% of its pathetic original range? Then there are issues like charging efficiency dropping so more power in for less power out resulting in higher running cost. Age is an issue as batteries still deteriorate even while not being used greatly reducing km traveled by that battery. Depth of discharge is another issue that will shorten the life so running the car down to flat is not good for it. Then there is the operating temperature conditions and the list goes on. So if you believe the hype then we all drive a short distance at an ambient of 25C with no aircon or heating in an EV that has a bigger battery than initially needed so in time and use it will reduce to the capacity actually required and then no longer be viable to do the required job. Looks like there could be a lot of excuses for not getting to work that will make public transport look exceptionally good. To hot, to cold, no sunshine, no wind, headwind, old battery, uphill etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 47 minutes ago, Redracn said: I love up to figures and quotes. As up to includes 0 and everything in between. An EV at 70% of original range is back in the land of toy cars and probably no longer fit for purpose and who would buy one with only 50% of its pathetic original range? Then there are issues like charging efficiency dropping so more power in for less power out resulting in higher running cost. Age is an issue as batteries still deteriorate even while not being used greatly reducing km traveled by that battery. Depth of discharge is another issue that will shorten the life so running the car down to flat is not good for it. Then there is the operating temperature conditions and the list goes on. So if you believe the hype then we all drive a short distance at an ambient of 25C with no aircon or heating in an EV that has a bigger battery than initially needed so in time and use it will reduce to the capacity actually required and then no longer be viable to do the required job. Looks like there could be a lot of excuses for not getting to work that will make public transport look exceptionally good. To hot, to cold, no sunshine, no wind, headwind, old battery, uphill etc. the figures are off Tesla web page ,,,I am not a fan of the cars either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 5 hours ago, Raven said: the figures are off Tesla web page Politicians say they're honorable in their title too ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 9 hours ago, Raven said: the figures are off Tesla web page ,,,I am not a fan of the cars either Musk would be the ultimate used car salesman. I generally ignore sales crap and go by what is in the written warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 Even looking at the claimed mileage figure of 300,000 I would not expect the car to last that long due to the very poor build quality .. Also I believe that replacement battery pack in the U.S is some were upwards of $35,000 ,,At that price I would not expect many consumers in the U.S to replace them ,,,so the car is then pretty much scrape . There lies the major issue disposal of the spent batteries .......perhaps Space X can send them to Mars ?? interesting how these are made up of smaller almost AA size battery,s linked together .. Model S cell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 People are blinding buying up EV cars with no long term thoughts on their longevity (and disposal) or how they will be re-charged! Or any thought as to what goes into making them..... I fear that the world is creating something far worse than what we have now..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 8September, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 The battery 1/2 life is one thing , but people tend to change cars on a whim much more frequently than in the past. Methinks 2nd hand Teslas will be cheap as chips when the next iteration of infotainment on wheels is introduced. Look at the i-phone analogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 8September, 2018 Report Share Posted 8September, 2018 Yes the silly Millennial s have to have the latest and greatest of every thing ,,,i phones being the prime example they must have the latest one or no one will be their friends ............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 9September, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 Well well well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firstone Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 One day it will be socially unacceptable to use anything else. Well beyond my days of driving thankfully. I think we live in a very fortunate time in the big scheme. It's not like you get to choose though. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firstone Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 25 minutes ago, tazzieman said: Well well well! Very resolute character. Interesting perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 Well I think you guys are being unduly harsh on longevity without comparing to modern cars. Most cars struggle to get to 200,000 km+ these days - the value goes down so much that any major repair is uneconomic. I agree that battery replacement is unlikely- though some people produce aftermarket Prius batteries - but then plenty of cars are being scrapped these days for dead transmissions, electrical faults, engine issues and more. The majority of cars never receive major work to keep them on the road, and are scrapped when they become worthless. The days of the heirloom Benz or even Porsche are in the past. So yes I think a Tesla will be worthless after 15 years or so, but that is not significantly different to most new cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 11 minutes ago, Coastr said: Well I think you guys are being unduly harsh on longevity without comparing to modern cars. Most cars struggle to get to 200,000 km+ these days - the value goes down so much that any major repair is uneconomic. I agree that battery replacement is unlikely- though some people produce aftermarket Prius batteries - but then plenty of cars are being scrapped these days for dead transmissions, electrical faults, engine issues and more. The majority of cars never receive major work to keep them on the road, and are scrapped when they become worthless. The days of the heirloom Benz or even Porsche are in the past. So yes I think a Tesla will be worthless after 15 years or so, but that is not significantly different to most new cars. My Money is on 7 to 8 years max from an EV and a lot less if used in not very hash conditions like below 0C. It is difficult to compare the proven with the unproven and it is a very poor (Chinese) example of a modern car that is stuffed by 200K as even most of them can exceed that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 Going by what 2006 Cayenne's cost new compared to what they are selling for now (one recently sold urgently for $12k!), I'm sure a Tesla at the end of its 70% battery life will end up as a Red Bull can. Could probably use the old batteries in the drink for that extra kick too! ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 Elon is going to use them in his Mars rocket .................. He,s a Rocket Man burning out his fuse up here alone ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 7 minutes ago, LeeM said: Going by what 2006 Cayenne's cost new compared to what they are selling for now (one recently sold urgently for $12k!), I'm sure a Tesla at the end of its 70% battery life will end up as a Red Bull can. Could probably use the old batteries in the drink for that extra kick too! ? In the old days you could always rely on a wrecker to hand over a few bucks to take a non functioning car away. With EV and battery disposal costs you will need to give them a wad to take it and that is if they even show up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 9September, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 I wonder what it costs to dispose of a dead EV battery. Anyone know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 1 minute ago, tazzieman said: I wonder what it costs to dispose of a dead EV battery. Anyone know? This may answer your question ,,,,,,,,certainly had me surprised .. https://www.afr.com/business/energy/what-happens-to-used-electriccar-batteries-you-may-be-surprised-20180627-h11ynt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 9September, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 3 minutes ago, Raven said: This may answer your question ,,,,,,,,certainly had me surprised .. https://www.afr.com/business/energy/what-happens-to-used-electriccar-batteries-you-may-be-surprised-20180627-h11ynt And after that? I suppose they will have a big lithium cauldron somewhere. I guess it remains "watch this space" whilst the boffins work it all out & Elon has another toke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 15 minutes ago, Raven said: This may answer your question ,,,,,,,,certainly had me surprised .. https://www.afr.com/business/energy/what-happens-to-used-electriccar-batteries-you-may-be-surprised-20180627-h11ynt Yep old unreliable batteries with poor recharge efficiency and charge retention will find homes by the thousands sorry billions that does nothing but delay the inevitable trip to landfill. Looks like wish-full thinking not a solution to the inevitable disposal. And why would you even need batteries for these applications with the inherent loss of energy by passing it through a battery. Sorry silly question. The reliable grid is stuffed and we will need every scrap of storage to maintain our lifestyle even if we have to put more energy in than we can get back out. Well at least those that can afford to. Too bad about the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troubleshooter Posted 9September, 2018 Report Share Posted 9September, 2018 Batteries?? I'll build a pod loop to the sun and melt them.....Dooon't worry....... beeeee happy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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