First time considering 944. Advice/recommendations

[robco__]

Hi everyone,

I'm considering buying a 944 as a semi-daily/weekend car. I'm 22, never owned a Porsche before and so outside the research I've done I can't say I know all too much about them. I thought this might be the perfect place to get some info.

There was a thread similar to this a few years ago that I saw, (https://porscheforum.com.au/topic/13941-924944-running-and-maintenance-costs/) which was really helpful but if anyone else is willing to help out with some more advice I would be greatly appreciative.

I'm looking for one for <20k and there are a couple that have taken my eye.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/2534324226880641

https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/details/1987-porsche-944-manual/SSE-AD-6470778/?Cr=4

My main questions are:

How big of an issue is rust? If there is a little bit on the bottom of the car is there likely to be a lot?

How much would an engine rebuild cost? The cheap one on Facebook has outright said it will probably need one, but what are the chances that another one I buy will also need a full rebuild/reco? I know it will probably just depend on each car, but can't hurt to ask :)

I've also seen it said that I should get a proper mechanic to inspect one before I buy it, is this necessary?

Again, any help at all would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks guys

 

[FAP911]

I'm a huge fan of 944's but word of caution - check them out thoroughly 

They can be an absolute money pit with the cost of parts and labour far outstripping the value of the car

Not being negative as Im a huge fan of 944s but hate to see you throwing away your money. Check for leaks particularly the rear glass hood and the battery bay 

Plastics can also age badly, warping and cracking! Sometimes better to pay more for a thoroughly sorted car

[Rob]

2 hours ago, robco__ said:

My main questions are:

How big of an issue is rust? If there is a little bit on the bottom of the car is there likely to be a lot?

How much would an engine rebuild cost? The cheap one on Facebook has outright said it will probably need one, but what are the chances that another one I buy will also need a full rebuild/reco? I know it will probably just depend on each car, but can't hurt to ask

I've also seen it said that I should get a proper mechanic to inspect one before I buy it, is this necessary?

Again, any help at all would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks guys

 

Australian delivered 944s do not generally suffer from rust. Not so for ones imported from UK salt roads regions.

The engines are very long-lived, provided they've been fed quality oil, changed often. If you're looking at a 944 that needs an engine rebuild, knock $10k off the price. If it needs an engine rebuild, there's more than likely lots of other items to be addressed.

You need to get a mechanic familiar with Porsches and 944s in particular to inspect any prospective purchase, especially if you're not mechanically inclined.

As others have said, "There's no such thing as a cheap Porsche".

[TINGY]

Run Forest run from that red car, looks like a world of hurt coming the buyers way. S2 makes it the car to buy IMO but not in that condition unless you have deep pockets and a fair bit of overall mechanical aptitude. Unfortunately you have to be patient and wait for a good car to come up in your price range.

My advice is do lot's more research and maybe get friendly with someone on here that has a 944. See if they will show you around their car, try and get as familiar with it as you can, if there is a Porsche mechanic around your area go and talk to them, maybe they know someone who has a car they may part with. 

No matter what car you get you will probably have to spend money somewhere, do some research on the major breakdown points of the car and how much replacement parts are as well.

 You need to talk to this guy at some point for a reality check on these cars @Jason E  

 

[Dreamr]

So ... I just had a look at that car you posted on Facebook.

I'll start with the positive ... it's a 944 S2. That means it's the 3rd generation 944 with the bigger motor. Usually more sought after than the first 2 and more expensive to buy .... BUT!

It's written that it'll need a rebuild. Not a good start .. it is a UK import (you'll need to do a lot of reading as to why I mentioned that) and it's a UK import WITH RUST .. 

Personally, I wouldn't touch it with your money ... but it is your money and you can do what you like with it.

Take your time and ask a lot of questions. Remember, they are 30 - 40 years old now so its not like buying a modern car. One of the best bits of advice I can give you is to buy the owner as well as the car. If they are knowledgeable and care you're on the right track.

The 944 is a wonderful car to own. Very rewarding drive car. My 19yo son just bought one so you'd be in great company ..

[brian in buddina]

where are you living @robco__?

Try and find some 944 owners where you live, to meet up, learn & discuss their cars.

Here is some reading resources: 

Clark's Garage website  has a section on "purchasing a 944" as well as lots of other info.  https://www.clarks-garage.com

Consider learning to fix your own car, I'm trying to do everything on mine & still learning. Lots of help to fix anything on these cars is available here on PFA, or on YouTube, Clark's Garage & Rennlist. 

Question for you Robco_: Is a semi "daily" mean that you have other transport available or does it mean that you only need a car sometimes?

The issue with the 944 is that they are getting older and unless you buy one in really good condition its going to need things refurbished , rebuilt or replaced. Parts are expensive & labour is horrendous on these cars. So unless you get one in really good shape it could be off the road waiting for parts, or waiting to get fixed.

An alternative would be to look at various Japanese cars as the parts are cheaper & they are easier to service. Whole motors are readily available as they are built in much larger numbers. But a JDM car not a Porsche. Its a hoot going for a drive in mine & the way they handle. 

Feel free to contact me if you want to chat on the phone.

Brian

[robco__]

Thanks for the input guys, its really helping me clear things up and learn as much as I can.

I think I've definitely been put off buying a UK import or one with rust, and it seems pretty apparent that finding one in really good nick is going to have to be the only option. That's why I'm also starting to feel a bit like I might be being a bit ambitious considering my budget ahahah.

52 minutes ago, brian in buddina said:

where are you living @robco__?

Question for you Robco_: Is a semi "daily" mean that you have other transport available or does it mean that you only need a car sometimes?

I'm in SE Melbourne and yeah I have my trusty Magna as a real daily. What I meant by semi-daily is that my friends and I like to go on drives a few times a week but also I'd like to be able to drive this car as often as I can really, but I would have a backup. 

Definitely willing to put in some time learning to work on it myself and basic things like oil, brakes and the timing belt don't phase me too much. That link you gave seems really useful so thanks for that, I'll get reading!

I have considered Japanese cars and that might still be an option, but I've just got that itch for a 944, it just seems right. I'm sure there's plenty of people on here who are the same.

[SteveF]

They are fantastic cars robco_ and I regret selling mine. Very '80 cool. As the guys above have said chat to an owner and ask lots and lots of questions. You might even get a drive if you are lucky. Up until 1985 is the first series and 1986+ is the second with a different more modern dash and a host of other bits under the skin items. I would prefer the second series as they look more modern internally. You might be lucky and get one under $20k but more than likely that will be for a first series car. Second series seem to go from early to late twenties. Then you get into S2 and Turbos which are quite a bit more as I am sure you are no doubt seeing on carsales. 

When you find a car get a Pre Purchase Inspection (PPI). Being an old car you may run away with all of the items you may need to do however if the car is a good one this gives you a list of items that you can work on over time and plan for. 

Best of luck with the search. This is half the fun.

 

[Jason E]

@robco__

Happy to have a chat re purchasing a cheap 944 & bringing it back to life versus buying a sorted Porsche & maintaining it.  PM me for my phone number if you're so inclined. 

I can also give you the number for the Surgeon I used when I needed to sell my Kidney & Cornea to pay for some of the work needed on my car.  Also a good divorce lawyer for when the missus totals up what you've spent on the car.

@TINGY996 could advise on costs of purchasing & maintaining a good one.  (this is the smart & preferred option).

@Rob is correct re rust & engine life.  Mine is at 215 thousand K's & still pulls like a freight train.  Rust is not an issue in Australia generally if looked after.

The variables on purchase are endless.  With bias I opine that the S2 is the best of the 944s.  Why?  Almost as fast as a Turbo without the complexity & extra maintenance.  Far more driveable in low speed everyday daily driving traffic situations.  Feels fast when doing licence keeping speeds. 

Turbos are fast when on the boost.  You'll feel like you strapped yourself to a chubby girl & then told her there's a sale on at Dunkin' Donuts...... 

The naturally aspirated 2.5/ 2.7's - slower than the above but handles just as well.  Buy one of these & drive them at 9 tenths & you'll have a blast.  Generally cheaper entry point.

Pre update cars (pre 85.5), square dash cars, early series cars - call them what you will are generally less expensive for all sorts of reasons.  If you like good A/C get an 86 or better car      ( let the flaming begin).  This is whole other topic - it will be predicated on taste.

Let me sprinkle my hard won wisdom.

Let me also preface my comments with the fact that I am not mechanically inclined at all (or at least I wasn't when I started).  Let me further preface my comments with the fact that I am not wealthy or able to throw money at a car indiscriminately. 

I bought an inexpensive (though arguably solid) 944 S2 for 10k in 2016 when the Porsche bubble was at it's peak.  I bought it interstate without a PPI.   I flew to Sydney & took it immediately to a very good shop who knows these cars inside out.  I asked them to make it reliable as a daily driver.  This cost me $16900.00.

Do I begrudge paying that money???????????   Well................. The car has never once failed to start, broken down or required a tow so my ownership experience has been good (but fuck me that bill hurt with just on one months ownership).

I then got lucky & was helped out (probably more likely pitied ) by a long time Porsche owner with lots of mechanical ability, tools & knowledge & I was able to do heaps of maintenance work required myself.  This was the only way to reign in the costs.

All Porsches are 'expensive' to own (unless you are able to do the work yourself).  Porsche parts are all expensive (relative to other Japanese sports cars.  I owned a 2006 MX5 prior to my 944.  20k to purchase - nothing to spend - reliable - fun - too small for me as a daily - plus you'll feel like someone kicked sand in your vagina every time some bloke ask you if it's your Mums car/ your hairdressers car/ when your sex change op is scheduled for, etc).

Porsche mechanics charge lots.  Good ones are worth it if you don't know what you're doing.

I personally would be very, very, very careful purchasing an import - the rust horror stories are endless.

Buy the owner.  If the owner of a car your considering has passion & can prove they've looked after their car then you'll likely get a good ongoing experience.  (I didn't do this.  I couldn't find a car for love nor money when I was looking.  This one came up & I jumped on it doing everything wrong.  Be wary of owners that can't find their receipts or can't back up claimed maintenance.  Most enthusiasts keep pretty good records of work done & money spent. 

It also depends on what you want out of your car.  They are 30 to 40 years old.  Many are looking a bit tired around the edges.  If you don't mind this - cool, just spend the money on reliability & motor on.  Me - I like it to look nice too.  So I've spent silly money looking to replace lots of stuff that worked perfectly fine - but looked 30 years old.

I am too scared to total up what I've spent.  It's well over $40k & much of what I've done has been done I've done myself (under instruction)  Fuck knows what it would've cost if I had to pay a mechanic.  Sometimes when I drink I grab my receipts box & crawl into a cupboard & cry & giggle until I fall asleep, then I don't look at the receipts again until my next drinking session.

I've had fun owning this car.  It is an outstanding driver.  I've met some great people & learned a shit load about mechanicals.  I will always have a Porsche of some description.

Buy a 944, drive it to a Porsche event, get in with a big group of owners then loudly exclaim, "What kind of idiot would buy a 911 when a 944 is cheaper to buy, far more balanced, and just a better drivers car?"  They will thank you for it - trust me.  You'll have hours of fun involved in a reasonable debate with like minded people happy to discuss your position in a reasonable fashion.  You'll probably become their best mate & Club President.

Again feel free to make contact.  Others will know more than me (they just haven't probably spent as much 😁).

[TINGY]

This could be a project if one could verify the kms and service history, although it looks like someone has been doing Starsky and Hutch all over the bonnet.

https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/details/1985-porsche-944-manual/SSE-AD-6523169/?Cr=18

This is an import and a twin cam engine but could be a possibility, been for sale on and off for a couple of years if memory serves me correct. I know you said no imports but it really is slim pickings at the moment for a really good car in your price range, you would negotiate hard on this one.

https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/details/1987-porsche-944-s-manual/SSE-AD-3730684/?Cr=19

Of course if you had the cash it would be one these.

https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/details/1989-porsche-944-s2-manual/SSE-AD-5763162/?Cr=17

 

 

[Dreamr]

1 hour ago, Jason E said:

@robco__

Happy to have a chat re purchasing a cheap 944 & bringing it back to life versus buying a sorted Porsche & maintaining it.  PM me for my phone number if you're so inclined. 

I can also give you the number for the Surgeon I used when I needed to sell my Kidney & Cornea to pay for some of the work needed on my car.  Also a good divorce lawyer for when the missus totals up what you've spent on the car.

@TINGY996 could advise on costs of purchasing & maintaining a good one.  (this is the smart & preferred option).

@Rob is correct re rust & engine life.  Mine is at 215 thousand K's & still pulls like a freight train.  Rust is not an issue in Australia generally if looked after.

The variables on purchase are endless.  With bias I opine that the S2 is the best of the 944s.  Why?  Almost as fast as a Turbo without the complexity & extra maintenance.  Far more driveable in low speed everyday daily driving traffic situations.  Feels fast when doing licence keeping speeds. 

Turbos are fast when on the boost.  You'll feel like you strapped yourself to a chubby girl & then told her there's a sale on at Dunkin' Donuts...... 

The naturally aspirated 2.5/ 2.7's - slower than the above but handles just as well.  Buy one of these & drive them at 9 tenths & you'll have a blast.  Generally cheaper entry point.

Pre update cars (pre 85.5), square dash cars, early series cars - call them what you will are generally less expensive for all sorts of reasons.  If you like good A/C get an 86 or better car      ( let the flaming begin).  This is whole other topic - it will be predicated on taste.

Let me sprinkle my hard won wisdom.

Let me also preface my comments with the fact that I am not mechanically inclined at all (or at least I wasn't when I started).  Let me further preface my comments with the fact that I am not wealthy or able to throw money at a car indiscriminately. 

I bought an inexpensive (though arguably solid) 944 S2 for 10k in 2016 when the Porsche bubble was at it's peak.  I bought it interstate without a PPI.   I flew to Sydney & took it immediately to a very good shop who knows these cars inside out.  I asked them to make it reliable as a daily driver.  This cost me $16900.00.

Do I begrudge paying that money???????????   Well................. The car has never once failed to start, broken down or required a tow so my ownership experience has been good (but fuck me that bill hurt with just on one months ownership).

I then got lucky & was helped out (probably more likely pitied ) by a long time Porsche owner with lots of mechanical ability, tools & knowledge & I was able to do heaps of maintenance work required myself.  This was the only way to reign in the costs.

All Porsches are 'expensive' to own (unless you are able to do the work yourself).  Porsche parts are all expensive (relative to other Japanese sports cars.  I owned a 2006 MX5 prior to my 944.  20k to purchase - nothing to spend - reliable - fun - too small for me as a daily - plus you'll feel like someone kicked sand in your vagina every time some bloke ask you if it's your Mums car/ your hairdressers car/ when your sex change op is scheduled for, etc).

Porsche mechanics charge lots.  Good ones are worth it if you don't know what you're doing.

I personally would be very, very, very careful purchasing an import - the rust horror stories are endless.

Buy the owner.  If the owner of a car your considering has passion & can prove they've looked after their car then you'll likely get a good ongoing experience.  (I didn't do this.  I couldn't find a car for love nor money when I was looking.  This one came up & I jumped on it doing everything wrong.  Be wary of owners that can't find their receipts or can't back up claimed maintenance.  Most enthusiasts keep pretty good records of work done & money spent. 

It also depends on what you want out of your car.  They are 30 to 40 years old.  Many are looking a bit tired around the edges.  If you don't mind this - cool, just spend the money on reliability & motor on.  Me - I like it to look nice too.  So I've spent silly money looking to replace lots of stuff that worked perfectly fine - but looked 30 years old.

I am too scared to total up what I've spent.  It's well over $40k & much of what I've done has been done I've done myself (under instruction)  Fuck knows what it would've cost if I had to pay a mechanic.  Sometimes when I drink I grab my receipts box & crawl into a cupboard & cry & giggle until I fall asleep, then I don't look at the receipts again until my next drinking session.

I've had fun owning this car.  It is an outstanding driver.  I've met some great people & learned a shit load about mechanicals.  I will always have a Porsche of some description.

Buy a 944, drive it to a Porsche event, get in with a big group of owners then loudly exclaim, "What kind of idiot would buy a 911 when a 944 is cheaper to buy, far more balanced, and just a better drivers car?"  They will thank you for it - trust me.  You'll have hours of fun involved in a reasonable debate with like minded people happy to discuss your position in a reasonable fashion.  You'll probably become their best mate & Club President.

Again feel free to make contact.  Others will know more than me (they just haven't probably spent as much 😁).

Oh ... and make sure you walk around with an umbrella over your head ... the sky is falling! 😉

Yes, take note of the above, but @Jason E has been our resident doomsday prepper ever since Christine (movie reference) came into his life, so we've all learnt to cherrypick his world ending prophesies .. 😅

[grantmr]

2 hours ago, Jason E said:

Turbos are fast when on the boost.  You'll feel like you strapped yourself to a chubby girl & then told her there's a sale on at Dunkin' Donuts......

Sometimes when I drink I grab my receipts box & crawl into a cupboard & cry & giggle until I fall asleep, then I don't look at the receipts again until my next drinking session.

How do I like a post more than once?

[Rob]

1 hour ago, grantmr said:

How do I like a post more than once?

I've told @Jason E  many times that he missed his calling - he should have been a comedian - and he has the face for it...

[brian in buddina]

6 hours ago, Jason E said:

plus you'll feel like someone kicked sand in your vagina

Too much information!

[TINGY]

2 hours ago, Rob said:

I've told @Jason E  many times that he missed his calling - he should have been a comedian - and he has the face for it...

On radio?

[Dreamr]

23 hours ago, grantmr said:

How do I like a post more than once?

You don't ... it only encourages him!! ..

[Jason E]

12 hours ago, Dreamr said:

You don't ... it only encourages him!! ..

don't be like that Ronnie......

 

[Dreamr]

28 minutes ago, Jason E said:

don't be like that Ronnie......

 

You know how I feel about you! ...