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HOLDEN SENATOR 6.2 V8


Niko
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Now I am not a V8 HOLDEN or FORD fan never have been never will be.   Big cumbersome clunky heaps of shit in my opinion.

BUT.   Yesterday a mate threw me the keys to his Commodore and said take it for a drive.

So, thinking, this big banger will be just like the rest, unsophisticated, and handle like a bowl of goldfish....

Well this LS9 6.2 litre, Supercharged Senator, was the exact opposite.    It only has 7000k on the clock and had been in hibernation for 7 months.   This was it;s first time out since then and I had the honour...by myself.....

Well, I have to say, it ticked all the boxes for me., and I could be converted going on this thing.

Sitting on 80Kmph around the bends it was just perfect.   Easy to drive, lots of docile mannners.

At one stage I flicked the paddles back to second, gave it a bit of a boot and the rear end immediately stepped out a tad, then gripped and off it went.

What a shame this was the last car that Holden built.    In my opinion, it had finally come of age, a great car, a local car, and apparently the most powerful car ever made in Australia.

Anyway, it was a new experience for me, and after all the shit I have put on Holdens over the years....I'm sorry.    You finally made a great car....

half an hour in this beast was no where near enough, but I have been promised another drive next time I'm over his way. 

If you know anyone with one, I suggest you try and take it for a drive.   It is an amazing car.   

It felt really weird hopping back into the Cayman.    The brute force just not there..   But ....I'll stick with the P brand.     

 

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1 hour ago, Niko said:

 

At one stage I flicked the paddles back to second, gave it a bit of a boot and the rear end immediately stepped out a tad, then gripped and off it went.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Must be something about V8's with paddles and flicking down to second.  Have you had a go in a  V8 ( no forced induction)  with a perhaps better / more enjoyable 7 speed box  that came off a german production line with M button thingy on the steering wheel.  The symphony / theatrics pre getting your foot flat to the floor with the extra 2 cyclinders over a flat 6 after the downshift isnt too shabby either.

Trust you weren't a passenger in the car when those pics were taken or is your mate closer to 7ft and  requires the seat right back. Or am I too used to p car seat dimensions and my sense of scale is out of whack. 

PS From a  best of both worlds perspective, I  have it on good authority plenty of potential in the brute force stakes  in a p car with forced induction of a different kind to the senator if your missing that.

  

How do you think the brakes would hold up on that HSV on  a Marysville SMT run like for like pedalling compared to  your p car.?  

 

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2 hours ago, Niko said:

Well this LS9 6.2 litre, Supercharged Senator, was the exact opposite. 

I hazard a guess you mean LSA Supercharged Senator unless he has transplanted an LS9 into the Senator. The most powerful HSV ever produced was the HSV GTSR W1 with the LS9 engine.

The last generation of Commodore was a great car. My aftermarket supercharged modified SSV Redline was bullet proof and took a punishment that our Porsches would not take too kindly to. I was fortunate enough to have my wife work for Holden for 20 years and I got to enjoy a number of their cars along the way (including the GTSR) whilst never owning one till the final production Motorsports were released and now sits in the basement on blocks. Most motoring journos in the US couldnt believe how good the Chevy SS was comparing it to the E39 M5 as an equal at the time. 

As a daily car its a great understated car where clients wont turn their nose up to because at the end of the day its is a Commodore. I have since moved it on but I do miss its raw grunt and head smashing torque producing 430kw/720Nm at the wheels. Got bored and jumped into a go kart RS3 now.I regret not getting a Cayman though, maybe next time.

58 minutes ago, smit2100 said:

How do you think the brakes would hold up on that HSV on  a Marysville SMT run like for like pedalling compared to  your p car.?  

The handling of the SSV was brilliant. For daily driving around no issues, but with the increased power, I upgraded to 380mm rotor with 6 pot brembo calipers with Shockwerks coilovers and that thing drove like it was on rails. My biggest issue was the lack of driver support in the seat. Take that out and replace it with a good supporting seat and it would keep up with the best of them. 

 

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1 hour ago, smit2100 said:

Must be something about V8's with paddles and flicking down to second.  Have you had a go in a  V8 ( no forced induction)  with a perhaps better / more enjoyable 7 speed box  that came off a german production line with M button thingy on the steering wheel.  The symphony / theatrics pre getting your foot flat to the floor with the extra 2 cyclinders over a flat 6 after the downshift isnt too shabby either.

Trust you weren't a passenger in the car when those pics were taken or is your mate closer to 7ft and  requires the seat right back. Or am I too used to p car seat dimensions and my sense of scale is out of whack. 

PS From a  best of both worlds perspective, I  have it on good authority plenty of potential in the brute force stakes  in a p car with forced induction of a different kind to the senator if your missing that.

  

How do you think the brakes would hold up on that HSV on  a Marysville SMT run like for like pedalling compared to  your p car.?  

 

Haven't had the pleasure of the 7 speed German box that you mention.

I was the only one in the car, I never even noticed the front passenger seat.   That was my driving position, the owner of the car is a big bloke and had his position lower and further back than mine.   His Missus is not into his cars, and it having only the 7k on the clock, I wouldn't be surprised if it has ever had anyone in the passenger seat.

We actually discussed a mountain run in it, we sort of agreed getting his power into a controllable state around some of those bends might be a challenge, but apart from that, I think the brakes would probably be ok (But in reality I wouldn't know).  I sure as shit wouldn't like to have the thing looming up in my rear vision mirror though.

I've grown pretty fond of my Cayman, I think I am satisfied with what it offers me.   More car than I can ask for...

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38 minutes ago, ArthurK said:

I hazard a guess you mean LSA Supercharged Senator unless he has transplanted an LS9 into the Senator. The most powerful HSV ever produced was the HSV GTSR W1 with the LS9 engine.

The last generation of Commodore was a great car. My aftermarket supercharged modified SSV Redline was bullet proof and took a punishment that our Porsches would not take too kindly to. I was fortunate enough to have my wife work for Holden for 20 years and I got to enjoy a number of their cars along the way (including the GTSR) whilst never owning one till the final production Motorsports were released and now sits in the basement on blocks. Most motoring journos in the US couldnt believe how good the Chevy SS was comparing it to the E39 M5 as an equal at the time. 

As a daily car its a great understated car where clients wont turn their nose up to because at the end of the day its is a Commodore. I have since moved it on but I do miss its raw grunt and head smashing torque producing 430kw/720Nm at the wheels. Got bored and jumped into a go kart RS3 now.I regret not getting a Cayman though, maybe next time.

The handling of the SSV was brilliant. For daily driving around no issues, but with the increased power, I upgraded to 380mm rotor with 6 pot brembo calipers with Shockwerks coilovers and that thing drove like it was on rails. My biggest issue was the lack of driver support in the seat. Take that out and replace it with a good supporting seat and it would keep up with the best of them. 

 

Arthur, I have no doubt you are spot on, I just looked on the internet trying to work out what I thought it was as I was posting up the photos.  

I thought  I had it right, but I guess not.   My apologies there,  I know SFA about Commodores.    

I agree that you could definitely use this one as a daily driver.   It definitely had lots of road manners.   

I hadn't driven a V8 Commodore for about 13 years and then they were SS's used in conjunction with my work place back then..  

Brutes of things, but in my opinion very unrefined and not enjoyable as a daily.  

This thing has really changed my mind, and it's just a shame they (HOLDEN) are no longer producing these types of cars.

Best of both worlds, nice to drive sedately and obviously more power than you can poke a stick at when you want it.

This one was purchased as a future investment, and I don't think it will be getting many more K's on the clock.

what's the saying on the back window..."I just want one".   

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45 minutes ago, Niko said:

and then they were SS's used in conjunction with my work place back then..  

Legend has it those vehicles were “improved”, engine and suspension?

Many years ago I hired a Statesman to drive to the Bathurst 1000 (work) and had a few guys in the car, we were all blown away at how good it was at consuming country miles in great comfort and almost silence.  Some Australian cars did/do their intended jobs exceptionally well.  

But you couldn’t!

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My quick 2cents!

I have punted a HSV Coupe aggressively through the twisty bits. Indeed the reefton - Marysville route as well

1. Weight - No amount of power makes up for the increase in weight over say a cayman in handling dynamics

2. Traction - I found it struggled to put the power down. Traction control continuously intervenes you can turn it of however you just get oversteer and wheel spin.

3. Handling - Great however not in the same league. You are very aware of weight transfer throughout the chassis especially in the front end.

4. Brakes - They got hot real hot, like smoke coming of hot! (Possibly not on the braking package of this later car)

 

Overall a really great outcome given its family car origins  and it was built in this country.

However not fair to compare it to a purpose designed sports car. Especially something like a cayman which is almost cheating when it comes to the “twistys”

 

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1 hour ago, Niko said:

Arthur, I have no doubt you are spot on, I just looked on the internet trying to work out what I thought it was as I was posting up the photos.  

I thought  I had it right, but I guess not.   My apologies there,  I know SFA about Commodores.    

I agree that you could definitely use this one as a daily driver.   It definitely had lots of road manners.   

I hadn't driven a V8 Commodore for about 13 years and then they were SS's used in conjunction with my work place back then..  

Brutes of things, but in my opinion very unrefined and not enjoyable as a daily.  

This thing has really changed my mind, and it's just a shame they (HOLDEN) are no longer producing these types of cars.

Best of both worlds, nice to drive sedately and obviously more power than you can poke a stick at when you want it.

This one was purchased as a future investment, and I don't think it will be getting many more K's on the clock.

what's the saying on the back window..."I just want one".   

We better not see you getting around in a red jacket sporting a mullet 

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1 hour ago, Niko said:

My apologies there, 

No apologies required all good didnt meant it that way.

7 minutes ago, Grimmy said:

a HSV Coupe aggressively through the twisty bits

A bit unfair to compare a car that is now 18 years old to a cayman or even the VF commodore. Im a fan of the VE/VF, especially the VF for 50K you get a lot of car. With minimum upgrades you are  at a whole new level. Are they are refined as the Porsche no, but they certainly dont have the same price tag either. That's the problem we had in Australia we liked to compare a 60K to a 200K and complain it wasnt as good. 

Not wanting a long winded discussion on this just stating the VF is a far better car than most pundits gave it credit and the market unfortunately shifted to SUVs and it became the death of the local market. Supposedly we all wanted smaller cars but enough said. Just giving credit to the engineers and designers for leaving manufacturing on such a high for the country.

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I owned and developed a 1973 Jaguar E -Type. V 12 engine , rebuild to 6 L , Webber sidedraft carbies, warm cams, 5 speed manual race ratios gear box. The thing was a beast , going sideways under hard acceleration in second gear . Probably did the 0-100km under 5 seconds. Low rev power was awesome , but any old Subaru would kill me on the twisties. HP is only part of the story , mid engine , weight , brakes , suspension, etc , will impact . The Cayman is a Porsche engineering marvel. I am amazed how much performance is generated based on relatively small engines.

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14 hours ago, KGB said:

Legend has it those vehicles were “improved”, engine and suspension?

Many years ago I hired a Statesman to drive to the Bathurst 1000 (work) and had a few guys in the car, we were all blown away at how good it was at consuming country miles in great comfort and almost silence.  Some Australian cars did/do their intended jobs exceptionally well.  

But you couldn’t!

A major flaw we found with the SS Commodores, was when we put them on the skid pan (DECA Shepparton) under the harsh conditions they were put under, the power Steering fluid cap would pop off.   Then the power steering fluid would spill out over the red hot engine and you know the rest.   I think we had three incidents of that.

The vehicles we used were standard SS's whatever that meant.   I think what was known as the Traffic Operations Group back then had their vehicles modified.

I'm just not a big banger bloke...give me a WRX, LIBERTY turbo or even a Pulsar SSS and I was happy.

 

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On 29/11/2020 at 21:04, LeeM said:

 Good lord 😅😅😅

 Need pics of that! 

haha ok you asked for it.....You wanted to see the mullet.      well here it is....

IBrakes in particular, with our smaller Japanese type cars, never caused any serious dramas as opposed to the SS's and V8 Fords, which constantly  warped the discs.

We ended up doing a deal with DBA and putting the slotted rotors on the big bangers.  

As soon as we took delivery of the V8's we would have the rotors swapped over, and when the cars were sold off we would put the new unused original rotors back on them.  

We could even re use the DBA rotors on the replacement new cars at times.

The cars took were worked seriously hard, and were retired at 40K .  

Fimg20180104_16320963.thumb.jpg.d12f8b4afe314505446c8c4223f12b98.jpg

De badged and de spoiled PULSAR SSS and Mullet

 

 

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Always had V8 utes as daily's stretching back to the VN Commonwhore, so it was only fitting that I signed up for the last production run.

The last VF series were/are a quality built car and I'm certainly going to be lost trying to replace it as I'm not a fan of "Farm Vehicle" SUV utes.

Pretty tough trying to compare it with German sports cars  but there is something special about kicking the 6.2 litre back and listening to it howl.

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Parting gift to the ex was the last year of production 6.2, ss v2  commodore I laughed when she told me it would be worth more than I paid for it in the future 🙄 bugger me ithey are iasking more than what we paid brand new.    But I did love thrashing it when I could 

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