Simonoz Posted 12August, 2013 Report Share Posted 12August, 2013 Good thread this one. As a serial offender, i have given this matter some thought previously. Having had an R32 Golf and a BMW M6 both with PDK or similar, and driven lots of others, I don't like it at all. It is disengaging to an old fashioned driver, and like others have said, you end up just leaving it in drive. So, like a certain J Clarkson, I would rather have an auto in a street car. The new GT3 might change my mind about PDK. We will see. It will be quicker, and to most, thats all that matters. The 997.2 GT3, as the last Manual, will be desirable. They made relatively lots of them I think, so rarity isnt as significant as say a 964RS, but still rarish. Not as many get smashed as GT3's before because of stability and traction control But, until these cars move away from people who just want to be quick, into the hands of collectors who dont care about that, values will keep falling like all GT3's, until they bounce off the bottom of the value bell curve at about 15 years of age. As Mark 1 GT3's are starting to do. So, yes, in time worth having, but not yet. If you buy now you will get walloped on value. It might be a slow fall but still a fall. Wait a while and maybe enjoy an early GT3 in the meantime........... Or just buy one, enjoy what is sensational car, and work out how to make money elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidd Posted 12August, 2013 Report Share Posted 12August, 2013 Some really good comments above...unlike other overseas forums where they seem to strongly against PDK. I have never driven a PDK, and look forward to having a go in the new generation version in the 991 gt3.....just to get the feel of it. It seems that some testers have been using the gear shift rather than the paddles as the lever is now intuitive and a bit of a compromise relating back to the 3 pedal system. My dd has a really quick and effective double clutch, but I must admit that, most of my driving being around and in the city, I leave it in auto and let it work. But am struggling a bit with the thought of doing that in a Porsche after 29 years of manual ownership........... However time moves on and even I, at 66, am sitting composing this on an IPad and using voice recognition with my hands free etc etc. so Baby Boomers can move on! Keep the subject going, it's great, and a very important change for the best car company in the world... DD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgy Posted 12August, 2013 Report Share Posted 12August, 2013 Am enjoying this thread. Good comments everyone. If I ever replace my 993 it would be with a 97 GT3 preferably .2 but would gladly take .1 C I may be the only one that thinks this (although I highly doubt it) don't ever sell the 993.. just add a GT3 to the collection. Good thread this one. As a serial offender, i have given this matter some thought previously. Having had an R32 Golf and a BMW M6 both with PDK or similar, and driven lots of others, I don't like it at all. It is disengaging to an old fashioned driver, and like others have said, you end up just leaving it in drive. So, like a certain J Clarkson, I would rather have an auto in a street car. The new GT3 might change my mind about PDK. We will see. It will be quicker, and to most, thats all that matters. The 997.2 GT3, as the last Manual, will be desirable. They made relatively lots of them I think, so rarity isnt as significant as say a 964RS, but still rarish. Not as many get smashed as GT3's before because of stability and traction control But, until these cars move away from people who just want to be quick, into the hands of collectors who dont care about that, values will keep falling like all GT3's, until they bounce off the bottom of the value bell curve at about 15 years of age. As Mark 1 GT3's are starting to do. So, yes, in time worth having, but not yet. If you buy now you will get walloped on value. It might be a slow fall but still a fall. Wait a while and maybe enjoy an early GT3 in the meantime........... Or just buy one, enjoy what is sensational car, and work out how to make money elsewhere. Wise words here mate. I think all the 6.2, 7.1 & 7.2's have some value to drop before the values plateau and go back up... as a baseline number I am going to say that value is 100K with a 20% buffer either way for spec+condition etc. Some really good comments above...unlike other overseas forums where they seem to strongly against PDK. I have never driven a PDK, and look forward to having a go in the new generation version in the 991 gt3.....just to get the feel of it. It seems that some testers have been using the gear shift rather than the paddles as the lever is now intuitive and a bit of a compromise relating back to the 3 pedal system. My dd has a really quick and effective double clutch, but I must admit that, most of my driving being around and in the city, I leave it in auto and let it work. But am struggling a bit with the thought of doing that in a Porsche after 29 years of manual ownership........... However time moves on and even I, at 66, am sitting composing this on an IPad and using voice recognition with my hands free etc etc. so Baby Boomers can move on! Keep the subject going, it's great, and a very important change for the best car company in the world... DD The little A1 that I DD has a dual clutch and it is fun as hell to bash that lever... very much in the same manner you see a sequential being driven on a track, you can hear it blip the throttle and produces a little bark between changes... but the rest of the driving in either D mode or S mode is not the best, the programming is either too lethargic in D or too aggressive in S modes. What I am saying its not as intuitive as they suggest.. but I am sure Porsche has done something about that in the GT3 by adding a lot more input signals to understand the scenario it is in. Also Dadvidd.... looking at your rides listed, you sir have my dream garage sans a nice long hood! Hi five! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.J. Posted 13August, 2013 Report Share Posted 13August, 2013 no doubt anything with the RS badge will eventually increase in value.. this thread needed a pic, so here is my favourite colour for the GT3RS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgy Posted 13August, 2013 Report Share Posted 13August, 2013 That colour is too common... look on carpoint, all the RS's are that colour! Mexico blue OR Carrara white Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.J. Posted 13August, 2013 Report Share Posted 13August, 2013 mexico blue is awesome, good luck finding one in Australia in that colour though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 13August, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 13August, 2013 Great comments Simon, David and Edgy. Very well considered and articulated. Edgy, i did consider selling it about 18 months ago but since I put the new mufflers, suspension etc on have fallen back in love with it again..... Edgy, davids garage is rather a special place. He is under stating his Daily driver a bit too!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgy Posted 13August, 2013 Report Share Posted 13August, 2013 mexico blue is awesome, good luck finding one in Australia in that colour though. Sad but true.. amazing colour though! Great comments Simon, David and Edgy. Very well considered and articulated. Edgy, i did consider selling it about 18 months ago but since I put the new mufflers, suspension etc on have fallen back in love with it again..... Edgy, davids garage is rather a special place. He is under stating his Daily driver a bit too!! Understated.. that is a good personality trait to have! I got to ask, are you looking at or considering a 997 GT3 Chris? Cheers, Kurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted 13August, 2013 Report Share Posted 13August, 2013 In the years to come a manual gearbox GT3 will be a collectable, no question about that. The masses (relatively speaking) will buy the new PDK GT3's because people will always buy the latest, fastest, bestest toy on the market, however, the purists are ultimately the collectors and will be the ones to drive the price up. Same reason why records are dearer than digital music, because the purists still buy them. By the way, I've just converted back to CD's after realising how bad music on an iPod can sound.. It's also the purists who keep the price up on older 911's. The masses wouldn't understand why one would want to drive a sports car with no power steering or ABS. And why would you pay that much when the A/C doesn't even work! It will be interesting to see in years to come how maintenance and restoration, and therefore their value, will be affected by the current crop of technologically advanced sports cars such as the new GT3, Veyron's etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 15August, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 I got to ask, are you looking at or considering a 997 GT3 Chris? Cheers, Kurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 15August, 2013 Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 I can see a healthy garden happening Chris.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgy Posted 15August, 2013 Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 Hi Kurt, Sorry for the delayed response, been in the harbour city conducting due diligence on a company the last few days so have been off the air. To answer your question, one of these days I will probably get a 997GT3. Came within a whisker of taking the plunge about 18 months ago but decided against it at the time, for no particular reason..... But one of these days.... C Nice! I'd wait a few years to be honest, they'll come down some more still that is for certain. As I said, you got to keep that 993, maybe I'm just biased though saying that? 993 is IMO the best modern aricooled car! K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 15August, 2013 Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 Not a series 2 but this one looks good Chris and at a great price. love it white. http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Porsche-911-2007/SSE-AD-863255/?Cr=6&sdmvc=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgy Posted 15August, 2013 Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 Not a series 2 but this one looks good Chris and at a great price. love it white.http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Porsche-911-2007/SSE-AD-863255/?Cr=6&sdmvc=1 Make no mistake... I'd hit that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 15August, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 Thanks Kurt, yes I think your advice is well worth heeding. Good on you Jim. Yes it's a good price it's been for sale for quite a while.... C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 15August, 2013 Report Share Posted 15August, 2013 Thanks Kurt, yes I think your advice is well worth heeding. Good on you Jim. Yes it's a good price it's been for sale for quite a while.... C Plus you get a factory warranty which can be renewed yearly up until it reaches 10 years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Posted 16August, 2013 Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 I can see a healthy garden happening Chris.. Ha Chris and I had a chat about this at the ACT SMT meet up. You could just see the first of the two little green leaves sprouting up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonoz Posted 16August, 2013 Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 Perhaps its timely to remember the two most important GT3 questions of all time? "so, has the car been tracked/rallied/raced/ done club events/ hillclimbs/drag races or any other form of motorsport? And "has the car even had an accident/been repaired/crashed/hit/scratched/rolled? I bought one once, a very low km GT3, and made sure that I had a letter from the prominent Porsche dealer confirming no accident damage. Prior to jumping in I called the previous and only owner who confirmed no accidents at all, only to find out later that the car had been sideswiped on a private track day, repaired outside the dealer network, and traded promptly for resale to me. It was a good repair, but that wasnt the point. The dealer didnt know, the first owner had lied, and it got messy very quickly. Its a shallow pool in which we swim, the Porsche pool, and its full of white pointers. Be very very careful when buying a GT3..........especially a cheap one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 16August, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 Very good advice Simon. It's great to have such experience whether it be of a pleasant or unpleasant shared on the forum and its always very much appreciated. Cheers C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 16August, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 Ha Chris and I had a chat about this at the ACT SMT meet up. You could just see the first of the two little green leaves sprouting up I remember that conversation well Martin..... Waiting and watching, just never know when the right opportunity may present itself. C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonoz Posted 16August, 2013 Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 Thanks Chris It was an experience I wouldn't want anyone else to share. Quite dreadful. Taught me a few lessons for sure. I'm still quite shocked at how convincing the liar in question was. It hasn't soured my Porsche experience at all, and it certainly isn't common, but if its going to happen to anyone else, it will be on a GT3 so please be careful you guy's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GC9911 Posted 16August, 2013 Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 Perhaps its timely to remember the two most important GT3 questions of all time? "so, has the car been tracked/rallied/raced/ done club events/ hillclimbs/drag races or any other form of motorsport? And "has the car even had an accident/been repaired/crashed/hit/scratched/rolled? I bought one once, a very low km GT3, and made sure that I had a letter from the prominent Porsche dealer confirming no accident damage. Prior to jumping in I called the previous and only owner who confirmed no accidents at all, only to find out later that the car had been sideswiped on a private track day, repaired outside the dealer network, and traded promptly for resale to me. It was a good repair, but that wasnt the point. The dealer didnt know, the first owner had lied, and it got messy very quickly. Its a shallow pool in which we swim, the Porsche pool, and its full of white pointers. Be very very careful when buying a GT3..........especially a cheap one! Simon, Out of interest, "& without wanting to pry into your personal affairs, was the issue resolved through the dealer? & to your satisfaction? Part of the appeal for me going through a dealer (& paying a premium) is for exactly that reason of security of title etc. I have purchased many cars privately & mostly the experience has been positive but I did inadvertently buy a stolen car once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonoz Posted 16August, 2013 Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 I can't say anything more than I have for legal reasons so.... The best advice I could give would be that you always ask for a written statement confirming that the car being sold is accident free etc It tends to clarify the vendors mind. And as always its caveat emptor! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-banger Posted 16August, 2013 Report Share Posted 16August, 2013 Thanks Chris It was an experience I wouldn't want anyone else to share. Quite dreadful. Taught me a few lessons for sure. I'm still quite shocked at how convincing the liar in question was. It hasn't soured my Porsche experience at all, and it certainly isn't common, but if its going to happen to anyone else, it will be on a GT3 so please be careful you guy's. A salient reminder about buying GT3s and probably applicable to all high performance sports cars. I am glad this experience did not sour your Porsche experience...it's probably more a reflection on humanity, unfortunately. I can't say I have bought from a Porsche dealer ever before, but when buying off well known dealers of Porsches I have still made sure to get a PPI and when certain specific claims are being made about a car I have made sure to get those in writing on the dealers letterhead. I agree with previous comments about the price curve and how you should try and buy at the bottom. History demonstrates that the RS model is the peak of collectible. As a mechanic has reminded me, there was a time when you could buy a 964RS for around a $100k! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonoz Posted 17August, 2013 Report Share Posted 17August, 2013 "History demonstrates that the RS model is the peak of collectible. As a mechanic has reminded me, there was a time when you could buy a 964RS for around a $100k!" Thats about what I paid for a certain black 964RS at the time. Thought I was a genius when I got my money back after a couple of years. The next owner and I console each other when we catch up, as we both know we let that one get away. In the end though, you really are just a custodian and as I went on to own the other great 911's along the way, it hasnt mattered. In fact, Im delighted for the current custodian, as he knows. Somehow, I cant see any water cooled 911's doing the same, value wise. There are just too many of them around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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