Cheap Cayennes

[AC78]

There was an interesting discussion started on another thread about older Cayennes starting to come on the market at around the 20 grand mark. That sounds like a bargain for any family man interested in V8 Powered Euro Truckster.

We also know the newer cars are harder to work on yourself and annoying little things tend to go wrong with them that often require a visit to a specialist mechanic.

So own up, who's gone and bought an older bargain Cayenne and how has it worked out?

[JustJames]

AC78, I can't speak from ownership, but as a parts supplier I can tell you that they seem to be pretty robust trucks.  

They're big and heavy, but they are called upon to go - and stop - like go karts. So they use up brakes. That's just physics.

There are two wear items in the cardan shaft - a support bearing and a rubber flex disc. Both are replaceable, but replacing the support bearing is a non-trivial task. New OEM cardan shafts are available, and are a straightforward swap out.

I'm starting to see demand for front suspension arms, as the bushes get flogged out. Again, the bushes are available (although not the ball joints) and OEM replacement arms are also available. No surprise, as the oldest Cayennes are now 12 years old.

Early V8 Cayennes had plastic coolant pipes in the "valley" of the V. These pipes split and leaked water, and if not attended to at the first sign of trouble, the water caused smoke leaks in the starter. The fix is to replace the plastic pipes with the alu pipes from later V8 Cayennes. At this stage, most Cayennes will have had this upgrade carried out.

[qstoria]

Good post there James. The forum is lucky to get that sort of insight!

[JustJames]

Thanks Q

Have a laugenwecken for me.

[smule]

Owned an early 04 turbo a few years ago, did the coolant pipes, then starter motor went so inlet manifold back off again, had to do coils, then alternator went which was under exhaust manifold... nav system is all but useless as CD based and heavy on consumables.

Went like the clappers though, only about 350 ks around town sensible driving (wife's car)

Sold it for a tdv8 Vogue, best family car ever owned..

[Grungle]

While I haven't got one of the "cheap" Cayennes, I got my 2007 S on the lower end of things - 45k, with 95,000km.

 

I work in Civil Construction and needed a 4x4 with low range that could comfortably do 9-10 hour highway runs if needed. The overwhelming majority of those around me either use dual-cab utes, prados or landcruisers (depending on their pay packet), but I wasn't overly impressed with any of them...especially considering the number of recalls we've had on our toyota fleet over the years.

 

So, I was on the lookout for something else, and after going backwards and forwards between the RR Sport and the Cayenne I settled on the Cayenne. It's brilliant!

 

I've had a minor service done without issue and was told the next one would be a big one, to include brakes etc. That was to be expected, but due to the number of km I'm planning to do (maybe 5000 this year!) the cost isn't really going to bother me. That said, I have traditionally worked on my own cars, including engine rebuilds, so this is one of the first times in my life that I've had someone else do the servicing.

 

I was also pleasantly surprised with the fuel economy, getting around 10l/100km on long trips. It's better than I was expecting.

 

So, some things that have done wrong? 

- The back footwell filled with water in a storm recently, but some google searching revealed the drains clog. A few minutes with a screw driver and socket set had the drains unplugged and no more water.

- My bluetooth streaming doesn't work. I have some complicated black box installed that makes the phone work (and it does), but it won't stream music. No big deal.

- The ventilation fan has started making a bad noise. It goes away when you turn the fan speed up or down, but it wil lneed looking at eventually.

- A headlight globe blew, which led to the simplest possible headlight globe change I have ever experienced! (although it's now fogged over on the inside - I may not have sealed it correctly)

 

That's it. Admittedly I've only had it for 5 months, but I've done close to 15,000km in that time. Thankfully my long-distance driving should be at an end for the next 12 months, so it's just doing the run to work and back each day.

 

I love it, and I'm very pleased I went down this route. I commented to someone just before picking it up that this could go really well or really, really badly, but I'm very happy so far. The wife has even conceded she likes it, and she was dead-against the idea in the first place!

[AC78]

Thanks for the feedback Grungle - very few Cayenne pilots seem to frequent this site so you never hear anything about what these cars are like to own.

[Grungle]

Why is that? Where are they? The Touareg forums are full of people doing weird and wonderful things, and even they seem to get excited when they spot a Cayenne with all-terrains or looking even remotely like it might have once gone off road.

 

Mine gets used somewhat frequently off road. It won't for the next 12 months, but the first 3 months of my ownership had it doing about 60km of posted "4x4" tracks a day to get to and from my work site. I said most of this in the "introduction" thread, but mine has done some decent, rough off-roading in the short time I've owned it. Suspension all the way up, low range type stuff. Not rocky, but often wet and VERY steep. There were no ill effects other than some premature tyre wear and a lot of dust in the cabin, which was to be expected I guess. The tyres are cheap(ish) MOMO 20's that were put on before I bought it. For all the abuse they've taken they have done quite well, but you can tell they're not made for it. Never got a flat though. Once these go I'll likely put some 18 inch wheels with all-terrains on.

 

I have also discovered a short-cut on the way home from my current workplace that involves a short section of an often muddy, wet trail through some bushland. It's only about 200m long, but it saves me 15 minutes sitting in traffic.

 

I'm not as impressed with the seals on the car. The road I was on (when it was dry) had quite a bit of bull-dust, and there were often signs of infiltration through sections of the the window and door seals, and a LOT onto the rear quarter panel. While it still works, the CD stacker is full of red dust. It's not something I noticed on my previous car (a jap-import Nissan).

 

It has done some towing too. Nothing spectacular, but it towed a fully-loaded dual-axle trailer over the blue mountains and back a few times. Fuel economy wasn't markedly affected - maybe from 10.5L/100 to 12.5? I have also towed a portable toilet through town with it - I got a few interesting looks and comments that day...

 

Honestly, I'm using it in exactly the way most people would use a prado or land cruiser, and many have told me I'm crazy for buying something so "exotic". I have previously had japanese imports (except for a couple of years with a 3 series BMW), parts for which are virtually impossible to get in australia, so I see this "exotic" as being a significantly less risky proposition than those. At least I can go to a dealer and ask for parts!

 

If anyone has any specific questions I'm happy to talk more about my experiences.

[Coastr]

In my street about 80% of the residents drive a land cruiser of some type. I was talking to a neighbour about a new family car and they said 'why not get a land cruiser'? I said I prefer used German cars and they told me how crazy the depreciation is on those. It's true that cruisers have fantastic value retention as a new car. I had to tell them that buying used after depreciation was the whole point. Why not get a great car at knock down price instead of paying through the nose for someone else's bush-bashed cruiser?

Still, I am worried by the trend that German cars are not living as long as they once were. It's not the engines or the body construction, but all the stupid brittle plastic that goes into them nowadays.

[edgy]

Still, I am worried by the trend that German cars are not living as long as they once were. It's not the engines or the body construction, but all the stupid brittle plastic that goes into them nowadays.

 

It's all those soft plastics that give it that "premium feel" that have a tendency to deteriorate with hard use, there is nothing wrong with them, they just need the owner to be mindful of this and a little bit of extra care. 

 

I guess an analogy is that a Hugo Boss suit has that premium feel too, but you wouldn't be rolling around under your car or doing yard work in it.

[Coastr]

It's all those soft plastics that give it that "premium feel" that have a tendency to deteriorate with hard use, there is nothing wrong with them, they just need the owner to be mindful of this and a little bit of extra care. 

 

I guess an analogy is that a Hugo Boss suit has that premium feel too, but you wouldn't be rolling around under your car or doing yard work in it.

It's not actually in reference to the interior bits, though those can be a worry, but if you treat them fine as said they are fine.

No, the plastic bits are the plastic radiators, plastic water pumps, plastic brackets, plastic windscreen washer pipes, plastic intake manifolds, plastic headlight brackets, plastic plastic plastic freaking everywhere. Even gearshift linkages made from plastic.

Look inside an air cooled car and the only plastic bit is the air cleaner. This is why they are still going and easy to fix.

[Boxer]

Great daily drivers and offer an experience well outside what an SUV should in the agility and handling dept.  I had an 09 Diesel and it was a great blend of torque, economy, comfort family duties etc.  Would like more poke for sure (S Diesel would be perfect)

 

Towed brilliantly and did light offroading.

[edgy]

It's not actually in reference to the interior bits, though those can be a worry, but if you treat them fine as said they are fine.

No, the plastic bits are the plastic radiators, plastic water pumps, plastic brackets, plastic windscreen washer pipes, plastic intake manifolds, plastic headlight brackets, plastic plastic plastic freaking everywhere. Even gearshift linkages made from plastic.

Look inside an air cooled car and the only plastic bit is the air cleaner. This is why they are still going and easy to fix.

 

 

Oh, I'm picking up what you're putting down... plastic coolant pipes is quite woeful, but I know they had a TSB on those and went steel pipes later? 

 

So I guess you have to ask yourself if you want a premium SUV OR a truck? As mush as I love the Cayenne, if you want a German SUV that will withstand an apocalypse get a G class.... The on road manners of a Cayenne are about 100 x better mind you! But that's not the point.

 

There isn't a more solid unit out there than the G, no not even a land cruiser, they're like a RAV 4 in comparison. 

[Coastr]

I wasn't talking about cayennes or even Porsches but just German cars from the last 10-15 years in general. 50% of my DIY work in the last few years has been removing and replacing plastic parts or electronic parts that died. IMO every single one of these parts could have been replaced with a better quality part without affecting overall function, but increasing overall reliability (all systems not just the engine) Maybe the cars might have been a bit more expensive in the first place but they are paying in resale as tales of fickleness spread. Lots of people will recommend a 20-30 year old merc as a great car. How many say that about a ten year old one? Every ten year old BMW is due a new radiator. How obviously avoidable is that?

I think the problem is EU recycling laws but I can't say that for certain. Maybe it is planned obscelesence or maybe it is cost cutting. Whatever it is, it dims my enthusiasm for some great cars and it shouldn't be like that. The cayenne is squarely in that camp. Vw development and already tales of pipes dying makes my very gunshy.

[edgy]

I wasn't talking about cayennes or even Porsches but just German cars from the last 10-15 years in general. 50% of my DIY work in the last few years has been removing and replacing plastic parts or electronic parts that died. IMO every single one of these parts could have been replaced with a better quality part without affecting overall function, but increasing overall reliability (all systems not just the engine) Maybe the cars might have been a bit more expensive in the first place but they are paying in resale as tales of fickleness spread. Lots of people will recommend a 20-30 year old merc as a great car. How many say that about a ten year old one? Every ten year old BMW is due a new radiator. How obviously avoidable is that?

I think the problem is EU recycling laws but I can't say that for certain. Maybe it is planned obscelesence or maybe it is cost cutting. Whatever it is, it dims my enthusiasm for some great cars and it shouldn't be like that. The cayenne is squarely in that camp. Vw development and already tales of pipes dying makes my very gunshy.

 

Honestly, its largely for cost purposes.  Every manufacturer is guilty of it. 

'

[spiller]

If all is well I will have my hands on a 3.6 petrol '09 for the wife in the next fortnight. low kms example and one owner. Really wanted a diesel but couldn't refuse the petrol one that came up. Anyone here owned the V6? Not brutally slow are they? It will be a town commuter and maybe tow the GT3 to the track every now and then. Will the V6 be up to the task?

[TrevMcRev]

I have a 3.6 petrol but in the next/current gen.  It is vastly different to drive than the previous model.. I drove one of them and had zero interest in owning it, just a bit "blah" - it confirmed to me it HAD to be a V8.  Then got drawn towards the current shape, took another look at the V6P and was very happy...and would choose it over the diesel.  

[spiller]

^^^ What makes the difference Trev? Is it the same engine? If it were for myself Id probably hold out for an S or the diesel but wifey won't know the difference putting around town. Just don't want it to be super slow, which I can't imagine it being.

[1q2w3e4r]

I've got a 955 Turbo I use as a daily I picked up about 5 years ago with 50k on the clock.  Its just ticked over 120k and its been great, I'm not getting rid of it i anytime soon.  It has all the modern comforts of a newer car that were standard on the turbo when it was released.  

 

In that time i've just driven it and serviced it, the only thing I've done is just put a set of brake pads all round on it (70k for the fronts and 120 for the rears).  The rotors still have life in them (were replaced when I bought it), and I put a set of tyres on it after 40k.

 

If you can stretch the extra 10k and get the turbo I think its a better bet as they have all the options standard (extended leather package, front/rear heated seats/climate control), air suspension etc etc.

[TrevMcRev]

^^^ What makes the difference Trev? Is it the same engine? If it were for myself Id probably hold out for an S or the diesel but wifey won't know the difference putting around town. Just don't want it to be super slow, which I can't imagine it being.

If it were my own car I thought the same, gotta be the bent 8...  The V6P is quicker than the diesel, sportier sound & feel, not as 'agricultural"...yes the 8 would be great, but in the newer shape was about another $20k. 

 

Current diesel V6: 0-100 = 7.8, 8 speed trans

Previous diesel V6: 0-100 = 8.3, 6 speed trans

 

Current V6P: 0-100 = 7.5, 8 speed trans

Previous V6P: 0-100 = 8.5, 6 speed trans

 

Current V8P: 0-100 = 5.9!

Previous V8P: 0-100= 7.2

 

So for me the current V6P was almost previous V8 performance in a way more modern car that will hold it's age well in to the future.  But it also drives & "feels" very different to the previous V6.  

 

Any of them are pretty damn good family cars! 

[Grungle]

A quick update on a minor problem I had recently on my 2007 S.

 

On my most recent trip over the blue mountains the cabin ventilation fan started squeaking. It stopped when you turned off the fan and got faster as you turned the fan up.

 

It got progressively worse until it became somewhat embarrassing (not to mention annoying) and I cracked it. This afternoon I removed the panel under the glove box with a torx bit, then unscrewed the ~7 screws holding the fan in with a 4.5mm socket (who has one of those sitting around!? me, surprisingly!).

 

It was pretty dirty so I gave it a clean and sprayed the bearings with some CRC. Squeak gone! A very worthwhile 10 minutes.

 

The fan had a VW stamp on it...

[AC78]

Nice work Grungle. That would have been a new fan and half days labour at the dealership huh? ;-)

[Grungle]

I would have thought so. It was heavy too, so I'll bet it wouldn't be cheap. Really easy to access though - it's right above the passenger's feet.

 

As long as I don't need to dig very deep to find the issue and I don't need any special tools I'm happy to poke around myself for a while, and at least narrow down the list of possible causes. This was a lot cheaper and easier than I expected, but I've learnt a little more about how it works and saved myself some money for now. We'll see how long it lasts...

[spiller]

If all is well I will receive an MY 2009 Cayenne for the wife to drive early next week. QLD car, 1 owner with 49K on the clock. Unfortunately not a diesel but my wife is not likely to benefit any more or less given it will be a city driver for 99% of the time. Seemed like a much better option than a Jeep 

[Uncle]

Nice one Spiller. I know Dr Ed on P.F is still very happy with his Turbo.

 

I've been eyeing off a 05 "S" with good klm's for sale not far from my place. My Wife drives a 80klm round trip each day that's 78klms freeway. Might not be a bad option for us.