Raven Posted 26January, 2018 Report Share Posted 26January, 2018 Thought I would share this ,,,,,,,meet a fellow yesterday out here from Germany ,he saw my 997 and was a owner of a 991 so we got to talking P cars ... During the conversation we got on the subject of Mission E and alternative fuel sources etc ,,,,,He was off the opinion Porsche was going down the wrong track with the EV as other German manufactures like BMW and Merc are investing heavily into Hydrogen fuel cell technology ,something they wish to introduce in the next decade,,I dont know a great deal about this but it sounded very interesting and a better way to go than Battery,s ,,Hydrogen cell is used to generate electricity and run an electric motor ,,,,,,unlike an EV that has to be charge ,,,the Hydrogen cell is filed up at the service station pump when it is empty ,just like current ICE vehicle .... He was saying the mileage is only dependent on the size of the hydrogen tank and that is was very easy for this system to cover the same range as current petrol and diesel powered cars ...The major plus factor was not having the heavy batteries in the car thus keeping the weight similar to that of ICE cars and not having to dispose of them when they are spent ... I am certain there are negatives to this tech also but I found it interesting that BMW and Merc have decided to go in a different direction to meet the future environment and pollution laws in Europe ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 26January, 2018 Report Share Posted 26January, 2018 11 minutes ago, Raven said: Thought I would share this ,,,,,,,meet a fellow yesterday out here from Germany ,he saw my 997 and was a owner of a 991 so we got to talking P cars ... During the conversation we got on the subject of Mission E and alternative fuel sources etc ,,,,,He was off the opinion Porsche was going down the wrong track with the EV as other German manufactures like BMW and Merc are investing heavily into Hydrogen fuel cell technology ,something they wish to introduce in the next decade,,I dont know a great deal about this but it sounded very interesting and a better way to go than Battery,s ,,Hydrogen cell is used to generate electricity and run an electric motor ,,,,,,unlike an EV that has to be charge ,,,the Hydrogen cell is filed up at the service station pump when it is empty ,just like current ICE vehicle .... He was saying the mileage is only dependent on the size of the hydrogen tank and that is was very easy for this system to cover the same range as current petrol and diesel powered cars ...The major plus factor was not having the heavy batteries in the car thus keeping the weight similar to that of ICE cars and not having to dispose of them when they are spent ... I am certain there are negatives to this tech also but I found it interesting that BMW and Merc have decided to go in a different direction to meet the future environment and pollution laws in Europe ... Hydrogen is a non starter for a lot of reasons. The first being where does hydrogen come from? Most hydrogen today is made from fossil fuel so why not just use the fossil fuel directly. Commercially viable Fuel Cells have been just around the corner for 20+ years but we are still waiting. Hydrogen is highly volatile and will ignite over an exceptionally wide ratio with oxygen. Hydrogen leaks through steel and embrittles it so long term storage at very high pressure is not practical nor is it practical to liquify it for storage and distribution. It also takes a lot of energy to compress or cool hydrogen. Do you really want 3000+ psi storage tanks in the car as they will be heavy and difficult to package. High pressure containers of this type require annual inspection and have a limited life span. Also a leak when filling will take you hand off. This is a world away from LPG which operates at around 120psi. You would need to be certified or certifable to even go near high pressure or cryogenically cold hydrogen. LeeM, Raven, Troubleshooter and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 26January, 2018 Report Share Posted 26January, 2018 28 minutes ago, Raven said: Thought I would share this ,,,,,,,meet a fellow yesterday out here from Germany ,he saw my 997 and was a owner of a 991 so we got to talking P cars ... During the conversation we got on the subject of Mission E and alternative fuel sources etc ,,,,,He was off the opinion Porsche was going down the wrong track with the EV as other German manufactures like BMW and Merc are investing heavily into Hydrogen fuel cell technology ,something they wish to introduce in the next decade,,I dont know a great deal about this but it sounded very interesting and a better way to go than Battery,s ,,Hydrogen cell is used to generate electricity and run an electric motor ,,,,,,unlike an EV that has to be charge ,,,the Hydrogen cell is filed up at the service station pump when it is empty ,just like current ICE vehicle .... He was saying the mileage is only dependent on the size of the hydrogen tank and that is was very easy for this system to cover the same range as current petrol and diesel powered cars ...The major plus factor was not having the heavy batteries in the car thus keeping the weight similar to that of ICE cars and not having to dispose of them when they are spent ... I am certain there are negatives to this tech also but I found it interesting that BMW and Merc have decided to go in a different direction to meet the future environment and pollution laws in Europe ... A German accent isn’t a prerequisite for not being a dickhead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troubleshooter Posted 26January, 2018 Report Share Posted 26January, 2018 James May, who is no fool, summed it up off the cuff 10 years back - Funny guy, funny hair and funny dialogue at the end of the video Redracn has a great argument and obviously knows way way more than me about it. The cynic in me has these thoughts I've considered about the demise of petrol cars ......Hydrogen cars sound like the way forward and of course the powers that be, will probably introduce it to the mass market in 20 years after they've gouged all the public that buy into battery cars by forcing ev's upon everyone .... called drip technology, as in drip it out to us so we continuously spend on it, when the powers that be already have obtained the future technology that will negate that interim technology, if you get my drift. For eg, Televisions - I could explain this with other examples as well but I'm lazy and Wiki sums it up quickly ""but only the liquid crystal display (LCD), plasma display (PDP) and Digital Light Processing (DLP) have been released on the public market. These technologies have almost completely displaced cathode ray tubes (CRT) in television sales, due to the necessary bulkiness of cathode ray tubes. However, recently released technologies like organic light-emitting diode (OLED) and not-yet released technologies like surface-conduction electron-emitter display (SED) or field emission display (FED) are making their way to replace the first flat screen technologies in picture quality."" Raven 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 26January, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 26January, 2018 31 minutes ago, Troubleshooter said: of course the powers that be, will probably introduce it to the mass market in 20 years after they've gouged all the public that buy into battery cars by forcing ev's upon everyone .... called drip technology, as in drip it out to us so we continuously spend on it, when the powers that be already have obtained the future technology that will negate that interim technology, if you get my drift. Remember when cds were the duck's guts? Typing this on my 2009 Dell ;<) Troubleshooter 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troubleshooter Posted 26January, 2018 Report Share Posted 26January, 2018 Think I can remember that far back - just waiting for "them" to totally change USB to another system .... most computers/laptops sold now have no cd/dvd player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 27January, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 27January, 2018 3 hours ago, Troubleshooter said: Think I can remember that far back - just waiting for "them" to totally change USB to another system .... most computers/laptops sold now have no cd/dvd player Of course mine still has a manual gearbox! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted 27January, 2018 Report Share Posted 27January, 2018 It would seem that the Honda Clarity is available in the U.S market with very limited amounts of pump stations at present ... http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/business/la-fi-hydrogen-fuelcell-cars-20171125-story.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 27January, 2018 Report Share Posted 27January, 2018 51 minutes ago, Raven said: It would seem that the Honda Clarity is available in the U.S market with very limited amounts of pump stations at present ... http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/business/la-fi-hydrogen-fuelcell-cars-20171125-story.html They will tell you it is zero emissions especially zero green house gas emissions which is complete crap given 95% of hydrogen in the US comes from natural gas and the conversion process releases large amounts of CO2 and requires energy to be input to the process along with the significant energy to compress the hydrogen. Hydrogen is also not cheap and would be a lot more if users had to pay for the infrastructure. But this is typical of the nut jobs pushing hydrogen. As long as the emissions including CO2 are in someone else's back yard they can be ignored. Virtue signaling gone mad. LeeM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 27January, 2018 Report Share Posted 27January, 2018 13 hours ago, Redracn said: Hydrogen is a non starter for a lot of reasons. The first being where does hydrogen come from? Most hydrogen today is made from fossil fuel so why not just use the fossil fuel directly. This is a world away from LPG which operates at around 120psi. But that is irrelevant apparently mate. We all know the greenies forget what it takes to make hydrogen and electicery cars! And we've all seen LP gas cylinders go off in a car accident, so imagine a fire with Hydrogen! 'KABOOM! ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 7March, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 7March, 2018 Happy Days! http://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/motoring/hitech/tesla-about-to-come-under-pressure-as-car-industry-embraces-evs/news-story/b0fe38061b88ee4b1a07d01e689ae65c "They say competition improves the breed but it also trims the profit margins. Musk’s vision and ability to innovate are indisputable. His ability to deliver results in a competitive market is about to get a stern test." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troubleshooter Posted 7March, 2018 Report Share Posted 7March, 2018 28 minutes ago, tazzieman said: Happy Days! http://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/motoring/hitech/tesla-about-to-come-under-pressure-as-car-industry-embraces-evs/news-story/b0fe38061b88ee4b1a07d01e689ae65c "They say competition improves the breed but it also trims the profit margins. Musk’s vision and ability to innovate are indisputable. His ability to deliver results in a competitive market is about to get a stern test." I've said it before, it's a scam I tells ya! #Time's up Elon http://www.breitbart.com/california/2018/03/03/consumer-reports-tesla-model-3-handles-great-but-poor-ride-quality/ "The main reason Tesla has been able to lose money for 15 years and not go bankrupt is receipt of $1.6 billion in U.S. federal and state electric vehicle tax credits on the sale of 160,000 luxury cars it produced and sold in the U.S. at a $90,000 average price. But according to the Tesla Owner’s Forum, the $7,500 federal credit will fall to $3,750 by June 30, 2018; $1,750 by December 31, 2018; and $0.00 by June 30, 2019. Tesla just reported that the company lost $665 million in the last three months of 2017, and about $1.9 billion for the year. About 80 percent of those losses were due to the ramp-up of the Model 3, which is a year behind schedule. More concerning, Tesla is predicted to lose $855 million in the first three months of 2018, and over $2 billion for the year." "the fact that Tesla’s Model S starts at $74,500 — over twice Bolt’s $36,620 starting price." and here come the rest of the manufacturers this next two years. Gives Elon more time to now devote to scamming stupid nose in the trough governments out of tax payer's money with questionable battery systems.SA was first, VIc is next LeeM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firstone Posted 7March, 2018 Report Share Posted 7March, 2018 So is Adani and Retail food group. Everyone knows it including government but but but. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 8March, 2018 Report Share Posted 8March, 2018 Talked to a guy at work with a Tesla 3 order. 3 Times it has been delayed ., latest is 1 yr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 8March, 2018 Report Share Posted 8March, 2018 4 hours ago, Troubleshooter said: Gives Elon more time to now devote to scamming stupid nose in the trough governments out of tax payer's money with questionable battery systems.SA was first, VIc is next So much opposition here to those stupid batteries that power just 30,000 homes for ONE HOUR! The government forgot to mention the $100m it cost for the diesel generators to keep them charged up though, not to mention what they cost to run Troubleshooter 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 8March, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 8March, 2018 Anyone care to give a one line summary of this smitty-like article? http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-07/fact-check-does-corolla-emit-less-than-tesla/9461096 Any Balmain chaps out there? Anyone trading in the trusty Corolla? btw you big islanders are a dirty bunch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 8March, 2018 Report Share Posted 8March, 2018 Mazda and a few others recon the free ride in relation to emissions for EV needs to end and a Well to Wheel method used. https://www.motoring.com.au/mazda-claims-next-gen-engine-cleaner-than-ev-110742/ Troubleshooter 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 15March, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 Hey Elon , whenya gunna put a battery powered rocket into space? Huh? Redracn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troubleshooter Posted 15March, 2018 Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 When T'Challa discovers a monster cobalt mine in Wakanda for him to exhaust. He can't lay his hands on enough Cobalt for his Tesla batteries these days as it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 15March, 2018 Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 2 hours ago, tazzieman said: Hey Elon , whenya gunna put a battery powered rocket into space? Huh? Coz it'd run out of charge 87km from the moon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 15March, 2018 Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 On 07/03/2018 at 7:11 PM, tazzieman said: Anyone care to give a one line summary of this smitty-like article? http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-07/fact-check-does-corolla-emit-less-than-tesla/9461096 Any Balmain chaps out there? Anyone trading in the trusty Corolla? btw you big islanders are a dirty bunch To think that green stripe across the graph has probably cost more than the black and yellow stripes to deliver, and is not 24x7. its the scam of the century for the lucky ones who made out like bandits. tazzieman and Redracn 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 15March, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 8 hours ago, LeeM said: Coz it'd run out of charge 87km from the moon Just whack a bigger solar collector on...and a bigger battery Or add a little explosion motor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 15March, 2018 Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 1 hour ago, tazzieman said: Just whack a bigger solar collector on...and a bigger battery Or add a little explosion motor See SA government have approved a $10m loan to a billionaire to build the world's biggest battery at Pt Augusta? He's a billionaire, let him pay for it! ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 15March, 2018 Author Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 12 minutes ago, LeeM said: See SA government have approved a $10m loan to a billionaire to build the world's biggest battery at Pt Augusta? He's a billionaire, let him pay for it! ? Nooo! That's not how big business operates! And they don't pay tax either. It's an outlet for "creativity" in an accounting sense Accountability. Now that's a dirty word. firstone 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firstone Posted 15March, 2018 Report Share Posted 15March, 2018 ??????? Is it too late to get into energy? ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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