Peter M Posted 7July, 2017 Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 A series of photos that shows the difference between the crashability of cars from 1997 and 2017. I was struck by how poorly even the premium brands of the nineties performed.http://www.msn.com/en-au/motoring/news/then-and-now-shocking-crash-test-pics-revealed/ss-AAmvSti?li=AA8ewQ&ocid=spartandhp&parent-title=upgraded-ford-mustang-manages-three-star-euro-ncap-crash-rating&parent-ns=ar&parent-content-id=BBDPcyG&fullscreen=true#image=8Pity there are no banged up 993's and 991's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Posted 7July, 2017 Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 Hmmm, still want that 350hp longhood hotrod.....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 7July, 2017 Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 The difference can be seen in the a pillars - as anyone driving a modern car can attest. A lot of these cars were at the end of their design life at this time - things like the 1 star rover were rehashed seventies designs. The e36 was the start of BMW designing with CAD (subframe cracking anyone?) and things really started to improve after that.the 911 is a 60's design and will probably fare badly. I haven't seen many ex-head on crashed 911 photos but I'm guessing those slender a pillars and close windscreen are not good. There seems to be a lot of pictures of 911s with rear quarter pane damage - they seem to hold up to that pretty well though!this stuff concerns me because I think about what the kids might drive when it comes time. I think I have to shelve the idea of getting a classic and look at post 2000 cars as a starting point. But the question is : do 20 year old airbags still work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 7July, 2017 Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 The history of crash testing is interesting. Obviously MB was one of the pioneers , even before seat belts became mandatory in the 70s.https://www.fanmercedesbenz.com/1959-mercedes-benz-w111-fintail-crash-tests/They certainly went to more trouble than Porsche , who just dropped cars from a crane! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 7July, 2017 Author Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 7July, 2017 Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 ....crash dummy just keeps on reading newspaper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 7July, 2017 Report Share Posted 7July, 2017 The impact forces from old the new look vastly different to me. All of the old tests the cars seem to "jump" up and around more, are the two tests equivalent? Not by the looks to me.I did have a 97 Mercedes and it did indeed hit a tree and then roll off a cliff, I walked away unscathed, no test can account for this and I would still rather be in that car in a crash than a lot of this newer stuff... I am not saying that there have not been improvements, just that comparison does not look even. The question on 20 year old airbags, probably not, mine did not. My wife's Volvo has a sticker saying something like check after 10 years.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 8July, 2017 Author Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 The impact forces from old the new look vastly different to me. All of the old tests the cars seem to "jump" up and around more, are the two tests equivalent? Not by the looks to me.Since 1997 the 40% offset test with the deformable barrier has been performed at the same speed of 64kph. That's why this comparison is so remarkable to me.I suspect the reduced "jump up" is due to more consistent crumpling on the newer cars. A few more kgs probably helps too! I haven't seen many ex-head on crashed 911 photos..Yes, that struck me as odd too. Truck load of side and rear damage examples from spinning though.Exhibit A: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 8July, 2017 Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 The difference in car movement has to do with energy absorption. More energy transmitted through the car = more moving around. The newer cars absorb the energy better.there are many downsides to new vehicles but crash survivability is not one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 8July, 2017 Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 The question on 20 year old airbags, probably not, mine did not. My wife's Volvo has a sticker saying something like check after 10 years....I took my Landcruiser in after 10 years (the sticker had a warning) and asked them about it ; 40 minutes later after lots of scratched heads and phone calls to the mainland they said "no need to do anything unless you have some problem with it" ???Imagine the cost of replacing old airbags (all 9-10 of them these days). Nah , modern cars are junked well before their time, aren't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 8July, 2017 Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 Imagine driving around with 20-year-old explosive charges in front of your face... oh wait.the history of car safety is something i could watch a good documentary on - from automobile manufacturers resisting safety due to extra cost, Tucker with the 'crash cell' and the pop out windsheild, volvo with seatbelts, Mercedes with ABS, the invention of the collapasble column etcI'm surprised Magnus Walker didn't get more greif for that accident, considering the way he was driving and the speed he was doing at the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 8July, 2017 Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 I took my Landcruiser in after 10 years (the sticker had a warning) and asked them about it ; 40 minutes later after lots of scratched heads and phone calls to the mainland they said "no need to do anything unless you have some problem with it" ???Imagine the cost of replacing old airbags (all 9-10 of them these days). Nah , modern cars are junked well before their time, aren't they?Nope, my Merc is 12 and my wife's Volvo is 13, and they will do us for many years yet....Yet another costly thing to make modern cars a disposable item.... What the comparison failed to show was how the top end cars from Merc, BMW, etc faired? How does a 97 S or E class stack up today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGB Posted 8July, 2017 Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 I did have a 97 Mercedes and it did indeed hit a tree and then roll off a cliff, I walked away unscathed...Hot lap? I took my Landcruiser in after 10 years (the sticker had a warning) and asked them about it ; 40 minutes later after lots of scratched heads and phone calls to the mainland they said "no need to do anything unless you have some problem with it" ???Trust they provided an Apple Isle Toyota service dept document covering off on that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 8July, 2017 Report Share Posted 8July, 2017 Trust they provided an Apple Isle Toyota service dept document covering off on that!They rang Melbourne , so would no doubt stickynote that call in the computer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 9July, 2017 Report Share Posted 9July, 2017 I looked up the rating for my 97 BMW - it was 4 stars at the time, much higher than the e36. But then it was an all-new design at the time, with signature fat a-pillars and curtain airbags etc etc. The same year that Clarkson drove in Africa when he set off an airbag on a heavily corrugated road.I suspect the late model 90s top end cars aren't in this comparison because the diffferences are not as dramatic. That is likely because the new tech is brought in at the top end first and trickled down. So a 97 s-class like a 2005 c class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 9July, 2017 Report Share Posted 9July, 2017 And this is a real world result, Sydney last night in fact http://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/porsche-mini-cooper-involved-in-chaotic-multicar-crash-at-roselands/news-story/0acbb8353c1e847a650ee9ebb79d85e4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 9July, 2017 Author Report Share Posted 9July, 2017 Surprised Al hasn't mentioned the Volvos yet..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGB Posted 9July, 2017 Report Share Posted 9July, 2017 They rang Melbourne , so would no doubt stickynote that call in the computerYou're a trusting soul... And this is a real world result, Sydney last night in fact http://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/porsche-mini-cooper-involved-in-chaotic-multicar-crash-at-roselands/news-story/0acbb8353c1e847a650ee9ebb79d85e4 MartiniMini came out looking the best. Went in that way too.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 10July, 2017 Report Share Posted 10July, 2017 You're a trusting soul....No , I told my wife.You must always have an escape route when it comes to litigation.That said , I like to think the best of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGB Posted 10July, 2017 Report Share Posted 10July, 2017 I like to think the best of people.Yeah me too, until I have to put 50 hrs into preparing my case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 10July, 2017 Report Share Posted 10July, 2017 Yeah me too, until I have to put 50 hrs into preparing my case.Hard work never killed anyone , well so far so good ;<) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGB Posted 10July, 2017 Report Share Posted 10July, 2017 Hard work never killed anyone , well so far so good ;<)Unnecessary hard work kills otherwise useful time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 10July, 2017 Report Share Posted 10July, 2017 Unnecessary hard work kills otherwise useful time.Well yes , inefficiency is best left in the PS domain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 10July, 2017 Report Share Posted 10July, 2017 Yeah that's a 2015/2016 Porsche. Big difference to a long hood with fg bumpers.On the plus side there is a low mileage 911 engine coming onto the market soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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