Excessive oil consumption

[Simonk]

Hi all

I've been monitoring the oil use in my car since I bought it a month ago. When I got it, the needle sat about halfway when the car was at full operating temp (at or above the middle line on the temp gauge) A couple days after the mornington SMT I noticed the oil level needle wasn't leaving the red at operating temp. At this point the oil was a bit below min on the dipstick. I'd done about 500kms so far. I put 1 litre in which brought the level up to half way on the dipstick and the needle. I've now done 200kms of city driving since then and the level is at about 1/4 on the dipstick and 2/3 on the needle. All measurements have been taken while the engine is running and at the same operating temperature.

The engine has no leaks, the leak down test was less than 2% on all cylinders. The engine ticking seems louder than my old Porsche but the valve clearances were adjusted 2,000 kms ago. As far as I know it doesn't blow any smoke unless someone at the SMT can tell me any different.

So do I start stressing yet or should I really be waiting longer to get a better indication of oil consumption?

[Chris-p]

What oil are you using Simon?

C

[Simonk]

Has Mobil 1 15w-50 and I topped it up with Penrite 15w-60, both fully synthetic.

[Chris-p]

I didn't realise mobil 1 came in 15w 50. That sounds about the right grade though. Might be a question for one of the oracles who know what they are talking about like Mike or Jnr356.......

I will be interested to hear what they might suggest.

C

[wasserkuhl]

Has Mobil 1 15w-50 and I topped it up with Penrite 15w-60, both fully synthetic.

 

Swap over to a 20w 50 or 20w 60 Full mineral oil. ie: drop the current oil, change the filetr and fill up with the below oil(s).

 

Such as Brad Penn , Swepco ,Valvoline Hi-Vis 20W 60 or Penrite 20w 60. my Preference is in bold and italic for these motors.

 

Try to avoid full synthetic oil.

 

This will slow the consumption.

 

*20W 60 is probably better for Summer motoring, using a 15W 50 during the winter is ok if you are that way inclined.

[T-Man]

Wise words frim Wasser.

Don't stress to much Simon. Mine loves a little off the oily stuff.

[Simonk]

Thanks guys. I find it hard not worry. At this rate ill have gone through about a litre of oil in 500kms. From what I've read, that's not real good. Ill try a different oil and see how that goes but I'd be amazed if it improved oil use by a huge amount.

[Simonk]

By the way, drove 60kms tonight and the needle is now barely above the red.

[wasserkuhl]

I wouldnt rely on the guage in the dash. Check the dipstick, motor running, on level ground at operating temps.

Using a non synthetic thicker oil, especially in an Australian summer will slow your consumption.

These engines were not designed for slippery synthetic oils. As such, they will consume vast amounts of the stuff.

It is also possible you have valve guide and/or ring wear. I would only consider a top end rebuild if the consumption continues when using a more appropriate oil......

[T-Man]

By the way, drove 60kms tonight and the needle is now barely above the red.

Come for a drive in my car Simon. Sounds like we have the same gauge.

No problem.

[Simonk]

Well a rebuild is out of the question this early on so fingers crossed a different oil will show an improvement. Thanks again guys.

[Vas]

Simon, sorry to say, but I don't like the sounds of that.

I would be getting it checked out.

Who is your mech ?

[Simonk]

Nine Plus did the PPI and roadworthy for me so I guess they are at the moment. They seem ok. Mind you, if it turns out to be something that the PPI should have picked up then I wouldn't be too impressed.

[StevepGT3]

Hi all

I've been monitoring the oil use in my car since I bought it a month ago. When I got it, the needle sat about halfway when the car was at full operating temp (at or above the middle line on the temp gauge) A couple days after the mornington SMT I noticed the oil level needle wasn't leaving the red at operating temp. At this point the oil was a bit below min on the dipstick. I'd done about 500kms so far. I put 1 litre in which brought the level up to half way on the dipstick and the needle. I've now done 200kms of city driving since then and the level is at about 1/4 on the dipstick and 2/3 on the needle. All measurements have been taken while the engine is running and at the same operating temperature.

The engine has no leaks, the leak down test was less than 2% on all cylinders. The engine ticking seems louder than my old Porsche but the valve clearances were adjusted 2,000 kms ago. As far as I know it doesn't blow any smoke unless someone at the SMT can tell me any different.

So do I start stressing yet or should I really be waiting longer to get a better indication of oil consumption?

SMT`s will do that to your oil consumption. Unless its obviously blowing heaps of smoke,or leaking heaps, i wouldn`t panic  just monitor it taking mental notes of oil consumption verses driving style.When I first got mine it seemed all over the place . but I think it`s more like a mother with a newborn that hears and sees problems that don`t really exist 

[JustJames]

A 3.2 should definitely run on dino oil.

 

Synthetic oils do not have the ZDDP (zinc compound) which these cars' engines need.

 

The other piece of wisdom that I've picked up it to use the thinnest oil that provides the required level of oil pressure.

 

And in this case, by thinnest, I mean smallest number after the "w" in the viscosity.

 

At Autohaus Hamilton, 3.2's get fed Mobil Super 1000 20W50, but my personal POV is that I don't have a need to engage in religious warfare over oil choices.

 

James

[StevepGT3]

A 3.2 should definitely run on dino oil.

 

Synthetic oils do not have the ZDDP (zinc compound) which these cars' engines need.

 

The other piece of wisdom that I've picked up it to use the thinnest oil that provides the required level of oil pressure.

 

And in this case, by thinnest, I mean smallest number after the "w" in the viscosity.

 

At Autohaus Hamilton, 3.2's get fed Mobil Super 1000 20W50, but my personal POV is that I don't have a need to engage in religious warfare over oil choices.

 

James

If however you do want to use a synthetic oil with a higher  ZDDP mobil 1 4TRacing has 1600 ppm and mobl 1 V Twin has 1750ppm . 

not advocating the use of any oil, just saying that there are suitable synthetics available . I buy the 4t 15/50 in a 20ltr drum at a comparable price to buying  20ltrs in 5 ltr bottles of the normal mobil 1

[JustJames]

Thanks Steve - I live and learn.

 

From my involvement with other, older cars, I know that the lack of ZDDP in synthetics is a problem with engines of older design, but I wasn't aware that there were synthetics which include ZDDP.

 

James

[Babalouie]

When you say "operating temperature", do you mean that the temp needle is at 9 o'clock on the dial?

[Simonk]

First dipstick reading was done with the needle on the line just below 9 o'clock. Second reading 200kms later was at 9oclock.

[StevepGT3]

No worries James , Getting information from oil companies these days is like pulling teeth. most that I have contacted will only tell you that yes they have reduced the ZDDP level to meet with current emission standards and to not clog up the catalytic converters, but that the level is sufficient for protection to the cams and rockers.(BULLSHIT) lots of research has uncovered that if the product states that it is suitable for older style engines , or that it is for racing purposes only then it generally has a higher level of ZDDP  example Mobil 1 racing has a ZDDP level of 1800 ppm 

[Babalouie]

Penrite are pretty good, they list the zinc % on the product sheets of their range, eg: http://www.penriteoil.com.au/pis_pdfs/0EVERYDAY%2015W-40%20Aug%202012.pdf

[Simonk]

Interesting read below confirms wasserkuhl's opinion... It seems my car would have been fed Mobil Super 1000 20W50 in the previous service. It now has the mobil 1 15W50

 

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/109569-mobil-1-inceased-oil-consumption.html

[Simonk]

Hey guys

 

Just reading up on doing an oil change in these things and wondering if you have any tips?

 

I know there's two plugs to come off. I assume they're farely obvious? Do you think I'll need to replace the washers. Last oil change was in November. If so, where do I get them from?

 

Are the filters pretty standard and available from somewhere like autobarn? Can anyone tell me what type I need or where I can find out? It would be handy to have the replacement before I start.

 

I read that when you take the plug off the tank, it pretty much falls out in a couple seconds. I've got one of those vacuum contraptions  that sucks the oil from out of the filler. I was thinking of giving that a go and trying to get as much of it out as I can and then removing the plugs. What do you think? Would I be able to get enough out to avoid having to drain it out the bottom?

 

I don't have a torque wrench to do the plugs back up. Will I be ok as long as I'm not too heavy handed?

 

I've read it's possible to do it without jacking up the car. A standard bucket isn't going to fit under there so what do you guys use?

 

Anything else I should be wary of?

[Stepo]

Hi Simon,

 

Re oil usage: as a DD, my 3.2 used around 2 litres extra over 10,000 km driven within 1 yr.  No oil leaks and no smoke.

Oil is non-synthetic and 20-50 Mobil.  I buy the Super 1000 to top up.

 

I find these gauges a little tricky to go by and rely on the dip stick.  The gauges can be erratic depending on whether you're idling or driving.  

 

The temp/oil gauge is usually at about the 2/3rd mark when serviced and can go down towards red in between services.  This gauge drops when driving hard and climbs at idle, especially when warm.  If I notice it sitting on red I usually top up with about 3/4 of a litre. 

 

The other gauge tells me I have oil to the engine at revs.  If that baby goes down when revving, the engine needs to get turned off straight away as somthings wrong.  It naturally drops when the engine is idling.

 

Maybe these gauges bacame more stable with later model cars?

It could be that you are worried about the far left gauge, but maybe it hasn’t been serviced and filled up to the top recently??  I thought most cars used a bit of oil and it was normal.

 

Cheers,

Peter

[OZ930]

I use Fuchs.  The car was running Fuchs when I bought it, Autowerks use it, so I stayed with it.

 

I check the oil manually, and

 

I want to see low oil temp with high oil pressure (not excessive).  If it goes the other way, there is a problem.