Redracn Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Article tells it how it is in relation to the Prius Hybrid. https://drivetribe.com/p/WToDjOIERvGVf1cKSup-og?iid=VpQ56DGiT0mCQjmroCzhrA&utm_campaign=GTN&utm_medium=fb&utm_source=network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantmr Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 About the only counter-argument to that is that it's a test-bed for technology. The "you've got to start somewhere" argument.I guess it also has the run-on effect of making people aware of green technologies. I imagine Prius owners are also likely to recycle, conserve household energy, eat less beef and forego shoes haha. Where are my firesticks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 About the only counter-argument to that is that it's a test-bed for technology. The "you've got to start somewhere" argument.I guess it also has the run-on effect of making people aware of green technologies. I imagine Prius owners are also likely to recycle, conserve household energy, eat less beef and forego shoes haha. Where are my firesticks?You forgot, look down on the rest of us from atop Mount Pious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 "On March 31, 2006, CNW Marketing Research, Inc., a private and independently owned automotive research company released a report titled, “Hybrids Consume More Energy in Lifetime Than Chevrolet's Tahoe SUV” " nuff said really! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy468 Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 The great eco con huh? The Prius is the very tip of the iceberg of the greatest con in history .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 I drove one of these Tahoe's (GMC Yukon) recently and the fact that it is better for our environment is amazing!! At almost 6m long and 3 tonne with a 5.7 litre V8 that would never have the word economical associated with it is proof indeed of this con. Almost as big as the CO2 emissions con!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantmr Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 "On March 31, 2006, CNW Marketing Research, Inc., a private and independently owned automotive research company released a report titled, “Hybrids Consume More Energy in Lifetime Than Chevrolet's Tahoe SUV” " nuff said really!https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CNW_Marketing_Research#Controversy"The Prius and smaller hybrids in general now cost less per mile than any large SUV, but still more than most normal 'economy' cars according to their own data"You guys aren't actually saying the CO2 emissions and man-made climate change are a con are you? The scientific community has been in consensus for years. There's data to prove it. Even if it's a huge global conspiracy, where's the harm in reducing our consumption and emissions?I don't want to start a flame war. I hate Prius' as much as the next guy, and they can pry my Porsche keys from my cold dead hands, but at some point we have to acknowledge that unfettered pollution isn't good for anybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CNW_Marketing_Research#Controversy"The Prius and smaller hybrids in general now cost less per mile than any large SUV, but still more than most normal 'economy' cars according to their own data"You guys aren't actually saying the CO2 emissions and man-made climate change are a con are you? The scientific community has been in consensus for years. There's data to prove it. Even if it's a huge global conspiracy, where's the harm in reducing our consumption and emissions?I don't want to start a flame war. I hate Prius' as much as the next guy, and they can pry my Porsche keys from my cold dead hands, but at some point we have to acknowledge that unfettered pollution isn't good for anybody.You have missed the point here somewhat, they are saying that from conception to it's end life the Prius uses more resources/ energy due to it's makeup than a thundering SUV. Yes the SUV will use more once it gets to the consumer, but the Prius is way behind to start with.I was referring to the CO2 con forced upon us by our governments, the automobile accounts for a very small percentage of global pollution and the noxious gas output of diesels, which most are turning to because of lower CO2 emissions is horrendous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantmr Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Valid points. I need to do more research, I'm aware the battery making/disposal have huge impacts, but I still find it hard to believe a big-ass SUV is going to be more environmental. There's a lot more factors to consider than just the manufacturing side. If I get a bit of free time I'll look into it further.I remember when catalytic converters were introduced and everybody was hating on them. But then over the long term smog went down in most urban areas. I'm not sure there's a con. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy468 Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 ""You guys aren't actually saying the CO2 emissions and man-made climate change are a con are you? The scientific community has been in consensus for years. There's data to prove it. Even if it's a huge global conspiracy, where's the harm in reducing our consumption and emissions?""No harm at all in reducing our general consumption, and recycling, it's a good thing, and car emissions have dropped massively over the past decades and will continue to, per updated model as apposed to increasing volume of cars on the roads worldwide which sorta cancels each other out to stay relatively equal."Climate change" is the now popular term for the outdated "global warming", as that entire manmade global warming fiasco has been proven to be a farce, and a hugely taxable farce ... Manmade "climate change" is the tiniest drop in the ocean compared to natural global warming ... which by the way is on the decrease over the past 5 or so years and sea and atmospheric temperatures are now lower than when the entire fiasco was first constructed and implemented on us ever compliant taxpayers ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Valid points. I need to do more research, I'm aware the battery making/disposal have huge impacts, but I still find it hard to believe a big-ass SUV is going to be more environmental. There's a lot more factors to consider than just the manufacturing side. If I get a bit of free time I'll look into it further.I remember when catalytic converters were introduced and everybody was hating on them. But then over the long term smog went down in most urban areas. I'm not sure there's a con. Don't forget about the shipping of components from all around the globe, ships and planes not very economical...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantmr Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Don't forget about the shipping of components from all around the globe, ships and planes not very economical......That's generally going to be true for SUV and Hybrid manufacturers.I guess what I'm saying is don't write these things off as part of a "Con". It really doesn't hurt to play along with "Climate Change", aside maybe from a few bucks, when the positives are clear and benefit not just ourselves but the future generations.We changed to unleaded fuels and birth defects dropped, we stopped using CFCs and the Ozone hole got smaller, we started using Cats and smog got less... but we complained about them at the time when really all they did was make things better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 That's generally going to be true for SUV and Hybrid manufacturers.I guess what I'm saying is don't write these things off as part of a "Con". It really doesn't hurt to play along with "Climate Change", aside maybe from a few bucks, when the positives are clear and benefit not just ourselves but the future generations.We changed to unleaded fuels and birth defects dropped, we stopped using CFCs and the Ozone hole got smaller, we started using Cats and smog got less... but we complained about them at the time when really all they did was make things better.Not wanting to drag this on but..... cars are so complex now that the slightest problem in 5 or 10 years with them will see them uneconmical to repair, how is that good for the environment? The resources needed to make these new highly complex cars would far out weigh a simpler car, is that ever taken into consideration? Would it be better for the world if we all used our cars longer and thus reduced the need for using more resources on new cars.... we shall never find out as the govts of the world outlaw older cars.....The hole in the ozone layer has been debunked as a myth... it was never there to start with.... Don't get me wrong I am all for a better quality of life for us all, not the one the govts have lined up for us with their collective heads firmly stuck in the sand! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 1June, 2017 Author Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 You have missed the point here somewhat, they are saying that from conception to it's end life the Prius uses more resources/ energy due to it's makeup than a thundering SUV. Yes the SUV will use more once it gets to the consumer, but the Prius is way behind to start with.I was referring to the CO2 con forced upon us by our governments, the automobile accounts for a very small percentage of global pollution and the noxious gas output of diesels, which most are turning to because of lower CO2 emissions is horrendous.Yep as any Engineer (and maybe an accountant) will tell you it is the lifetime cost/emmisions that really matter. Making the virtue signalers feel good about themselves by moving emissions from the part of the life cycle visible to them to behind the scenes while increasing those emissions is something only a politician could come up with and defines stupidity. Also batteries in general when used in the power grid are an expensive, dirty, resource consuming, co2 emitting solution to the self inflicted issue of unreliable power sources (Wind/Solar) while overall increasing co2 emmisions being sold to us as the exact opposite. Must be politicians/rent seekers involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGB Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Yep as any Engineer (and maybe an accountant) will tell you it is the lifetime cost/emmisions that really matter. Making the virtue signalers feel good about themselves by moving emissions from the part of the life cycle visible to them to behind the scenes while increasing those emissions is something only a politician could come up with and defines stupidity. Also batteries in general when used in the power grid are an expensive, dirty, resource consuming, co2 emitting solution to the self inflicted issue of unreliable power sources (Wind/Solar) while overall increasing co2 emmisions being sold to us as the exact opposite. Must be politicians/rent seekers involved. You're right, but the average Joe cbf'd and has enough trouble understanding the interest rate on his overdue VISA. Plus Toyota put a shed load of Hollywood A + B listers into them....must be real and I need one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 1June, 2017 Author Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 You guys aren't actually saying the CO2 emissions and man-made climate change are a con are you? The scientific community has been in consensus for years. There's data to prove it. Even if it's a huge global conspiracy, where's the harm in reducing our consumption and emissions? Amazing what people can be sold. Prius drivers think they are reducing consumption and emissions when in fact the opposite is true they are emitting more than an equivalent car and as much as a very large SUV. No harm in reducing but best to make sure you are "actually" reducing and not falling prey to a con that takes advantage your desire to reduce while doing the opposite.As far as the man made climate change nothing is settled as there are many very well qualified scientists who do not agree that Its mainly man made and its catastrophic. But of course doctors of the study of old bones that claim the rain will never fill our dams must know what they are talking about /sarc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeM Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Most scientists are just theorists with no concrete evidence to support their claims. And that's a fact, Jack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANF Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 You're right, but the average Joe cbf'd and has enough trouble understanding the interest rate on his overdue VISA. Plus Toyota put a shed load of Hollywood A + B listers into them....must be real and I need one. Pretty much sums it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantmr Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 No harm in reducing but best to make sure you are "actually" reducing and not falling prey to a con that takes advantage your desire to reduce while doing the opposite.This is a key point. I'm reminded of Rudd's pink batts scheme that looked great on paper, but ended up burning down peoples homes, and all the plastics in those homes... and the people in those homes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redracn Posted 1June, 2017 Author Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 You old farts (baby boomers and your parents) and your climate change denial have done more to wreck this planet for future generations than any other group of people before you. I honestly can't wait till you start dying off en masse so that we can get some sense to prevail on the issue of climate change - large scale, not just tweaking at the edges. Best to keep ones religious beliefs private on a car forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantmr Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 You old farts (baby boomers and your parents) and your climate change denial have done more to wreck this planet for future generations than any other group of people before you. I honestly can't wait till you start dying off en masse so that we can get some sense to prevail on the issue of climate change - large scale, not just tweaking at the edges.Wew Sleazius, tell us what you really think. Finger pointing and name calling generally never help ones argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGB Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 Let me preface this by saying two things; I'm right leaning (politically), and we probably shouldn't discuss the environment on a cars forum. However:You old farts (baby boomers and your parents) and your climate change denial have done more to wreck this planet for future generations than any other group of people before you. I honestly can't wait till you start dying off en masse so that we can get some sense to prevail on the issue of climate change - large scale, not just tweaking at the edges.Also the Prius is an abomination, no disagreement there. If I pass by your place at night and you have more than one light on....or TV, or stuff on standby... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 1June, 2017 Report Share Posted 1June, 2017 I'm not sure wishing death upon a group people is appropriate for a car forum - I've hidden the offending post.and I'm locking this thread before it gets out of hand, please keep it respectable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 5June, 2017 Report Share Posted 5June, 2017 in the interest of clarity, I should also add that sleazius has apologised for his comments via PM. Hopefully we can all move on.Russ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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