Guest hepkat63 Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Hi, ok - so, i know a lot of people have been caught with this - so add me to the list Last week - I noticed that my oil level was down just below the 'low' mark. I did not think too much - and instead - before taking the car out again for a drive - I read the user manual and it said the difference between low and high was 1.7 quarts - so I added a litre of oil - figuring that would take it right on the high mark. I very carefully measured it out and put exactly one litre in. Today, i took the car for a drive out to the airport with the new wheels/tyres on it - and went via the service station to put the correct air pressure in - and while i was there - checked the oil level again. Would you believe it is up to the curly twist on the dipstick ??? Yep, nearly and inch over the 'full' notch. How can that be? I took the car home - and now a few hours later - took it out again (driving slowly) for about fifteen minutes, then went to the flattest place i could find (as my driveway is a slight angle) - let it idle for about three minutes and then checked once more - and yep - still up to the curly mark. I don't understand how it could be overfull - but i guess it is. So, i have hunted around the net - some say syphon out the extra - some say drain the extra (yeah, good luck trying to put the plug back in !!) and a lot say - don't worry about it - as it will smoke off anyway? Someone also said just drain the engine plug (as that only holds 2 quarts) Probably confused with all this quarts vs litres thing. What do you think? yep - dumb newbie !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Is the engine at full operating temperature and idling when you check the level?I know but sometimes it's the simple stuff that trips us all up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hepkat63 Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 yes, i believe it was at operating temperature after driving it fifteen minutes - and yes, idling when checking oil level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM911T Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 First thing is don't panic, you know what the problem is. And you've read the manual so no need to go there. I think the easiest thing to do is get a suitable flat container ( I use a clear plastic cake container from Woolies etc) and drain some oil out of the engine sump plug. This sort of contaner means you do not have to raise the rear end much at all. Let it drip out slowly, don't take the plug all the way out. until you have about half a litre. Seal up again, clean up and rerun the engine - measure on dipstick. Repeat if necessary. You probably just got a not very accurate reading in the first place, especially if your oil was clean. Unless your engine is worn, you probably don't need extra oil between regular services. All part of the learning experience so don't be too hard on yourself. Cheers Paul M Lakes Entrance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hepkat63 Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 First thing is don't panic, you know what the problem is. And you've read the manual so no need to go there. I think the easiest thing to do is get a suitable flat container ( I use a clear plastic cake container from Woolies etc) and drain some oil out of the engine sump plug. This sort of contaner means you do not have to raise the rear end much at all. Let it drip out slowly, don't take the plug all the way out. until you have about half a litre. Seal up again, clean up and rerun the engine - measure on dipstick. Repeat if necessary. You probably just got a not very accurate reading in the first place, especially if your oil was clean. Unless your engine is worn, you probably don't need extra oil between regular services. All part of the learning experience so don't be too hard on yourself. Cheers Paul M Lakes Entrance thanks Paul - sensible suggestion, will head on down to coles and get something like that and give it a go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCM911T Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Good luck, and you can do it when cold, probably easier than having hot oil coming out. The only proviso I should add is that the bronze washer may weep as it has been squashed. I always keep spares. If you don't feel confortable with this method you could same method or completely drain the oil tank with a bigger container. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Just a tip for next time topping up your oil like that. Don' worry about what the books says on what line means what. You don't need math to figure out how much oil you need to put in. In steps to make like easy Because i know some people haven't done it before and are scared to ask because they know it a very common task. 1) check dipsick 2) clean with rag and put it back in 3) check again (this is your accurate measure) At this point if it's somewhere between the high and low point. You can leave it or top it up if you wish. If its below the low line. Time to top if up if it's not due for an oil change. Continue to step 4 4) fill with roughly 200ml then repeat steps 1,2 &3. Now you'll know how much 200ml raises it. 5) fill it to you're satisfied with the oil amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tit Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Gotta be careful on the 964 - when the car is cold apparently the correct oil level shows at or below minimum on the dipstick. I think this is how Steve got in this situation in the first place.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hepkat63 Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 thanks guys - really appreciate all these tips, and I trust they will also help others in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Gotta be careful on the 964 - when the car is cold apparently the correct oil level shows at or below minimum on the dipstick. I think this is how Steve got in this situation in the first place.. When the car is cold the oil will drain back into the sump (the right time to measure it). If it reads more when it's on. Thats because the oil is moving around and will show higher on the dipstick because it sways. that's why you wipe it and dip it again then read. If there's more oil in the sump when the car is on. There's something wrong there id say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrest Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 When the car is cold the oil will drain back into the sump (the right time to measure it). If it reads more when it's on. Thats because the oil is moving around and will show higher on the dipstick because it sways. that's why you wipe it and dip it again then read. If there's more oil in the sump when the car is on. There's something wrong there id say. WRONG !!! WRONG!!! Ignore this post hepkat63 You are talking about 911 with a dry dump a very different procedure. Pauly is describing a conventional oiling systems. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 When the car is cold the oil will drain back into the sump (the right time to measure it). If it reads more when it's on. Thats because the oil is moving around and will show higher on the dipstick because it sways. that's why you wipe it and dip it again then read. If there's more oil in the sump when the car is on. There's something wrong there id say. the 964 is a dry sump engine and needs to be checked at FULL operating temperature with the engine running,Idling for at least 30 seconds on a level surface ,once you have established the relationship between your oil level guage and dipstick the easiest way is to watch your guage through the back window with the car idling and add small amounts of oil untill the you reach the reguired level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 Sorry Pauly but as Dave and Steve have said the oil system on an air cooled 911 is very different to that of a convential wet sump car. The engine has to reach operating temperature which then opens a solenoid to the oil cooler at the front of the car. This then starts a circulation process so until this happens you cannot accurate gauge the oil level and hence why the engine has to be operating at the same time. Steve's suggestion for watching the oil gauge through the rear window is a good one. Cheers C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 So does the Pauly method work for all the other non-air cooled Porsches? Just thought it might be a good time to fill in the blanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 26December, 2013 Report Share Posted 26December, 2013 So does the Pauly method work for all the other non-air cooled Porsches? Just thought it might be a good time to fill in the blanks! you should read your specific cars owners manual as to how to check the oil, I`m pretty sure that every one that I have read says to check oil level with oil at operating temperature on a level surface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hepkat63 Posted 27December, 2013 Report Share Posted 27December, 2013 the 964 is a dry sump engine and needs to be checked at FULL operating temperature with the engine running,Idling for at least 30 seconds on a level surface ,once you have established the relationship between your oil level guage and dipstick the easiest way is to watch your guage through the back window with the car idling and add small amounts of oil untill the you reach the reguired level So, took Paul's suggestion and bought a $2 plastic container (low profile) from Coles - didn't have to jack up car .. 15mm spanner, loosened off oil plug - but it was only dripping - and since i had some disposable gloves on anyway, decided to unscrew the plug out - but held it against the opening for about five seconds. About two litres got out before I screwed the plug back in. Clean up was simple and fast. Started up the car - took for a careful 15 minute drive, came back, let idle for about three minutes and checked the dipstick. It was about 1mm below the 'low' notch. So, using Steve's tip (best tip ever !! thanks for that) - I knelt down at the back of the car and put a few gluts of oil in whilst the car was still idling and watched the oil gauge - waited another couple of minutes and did it again. All looked good on the gauge, so checked the dipstick and it was about 3/4 of the way between low and high - so was happy with that. Thanks again everyone and although I have had a LOT of cars of the years, the Porsche sure is one different machine. I hope this helps someone else out in the future too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutch-monkey Posted 27December, 2013 Report Share Posted 27December, 2013 So does the Pauly method work for all the other non-air cooled Porsches? Just thought it might be a good time to fill in the blanks! no. GT3 etc are all dry sump also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted 29December, 2013 Report Share Posted 29December, 2013 Totally forgot about this thread until Dave mentioned it today. I am wrong about the specific vehicle with the dry sump. For some reason i didn't realise!! Sorry guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveF Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 I was reading through this post and just want to make sure I understand the process for topping up oil on my 1976 911. Apologies if this is a stupid question but from what I am reading the oil for dry sumped cars (eg. 964) should be checked and topped up if required with the car running and at operating temperature. For an air cooled car like mine does it need to be at operating temperature and running or with the engine off and oil cold? Thanks in advance for clarifying. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 running with the oil at operating temperature for all air cooled 911's and I find filling up by little amounts (I usually do 200ml at a time) works best to get it exactly level although I'm never normally that worried there is 12 litres in there! I only check when the dashboard gauge has moved a fair bit and even then it's usually still pretty right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 running on flat surface and up to temperature Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrest Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 I was reading through this post and just want to make sure I understand the process for topping up oil on my 1976 911. Apologies if this is a stupid question but from what I am reading the oil for dry sumped cars (eg. 964) should be checked and topped up if required with the car running and at operating temperature. For an air cooled car like mine does it need to be at operating temperature and running or with the engine off and oil cold? Thanks in advance for clarifying. Steve 1/ Run till the engine is at normal running temp. [Go for a drive] 2/ Find a flat surface to park up on. 3/ Leave the engine running 4/ Open the engine lid 5/ Remove the oil cap on RHS of engine bay. 6/ Remove the engine oil dipstick and wipe clean with a rag. 7/ Replace dipstick into the oil tank and push down till it stops. [Do not just drop it into the oil fillet tube. It slides down into place via a captive shape on the RHS of the filler tube. 8/ Remove dipstick again and take reading 9/ Top up oil as necessary to the top mark on the dipstick if in fact it does need topping up. 10/ Replace dip stick and replace oil cap Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jnr356 Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 fill to about 5mm below top mark on the dipstick and if everything is calibrated should read about 2 o'clock on the gauge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveF Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 Perfect. Thanks everyone for clarifying and for the detailed instructions (I like step by step guides). I will give it a go tomorrow. One other thing which got me started on this question and may be related. On start up it takes a while after driving (5 minutes or so) for the oil level gauge to register (it just sits on red). Once things are warmed up when idling the guage sits at the 2 o'clock position as jnr mentioned. When accelerating I notice that it drops and if accelerating hard, quite dramatically, almost onto the red. Is this normal? If not has anyone experienced this before? Thanks again. I am just getting to know my car and want to make sure I know what is normal and what isn't. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 17March, 2014 Report Share Posted 17March, 2014 yep normal, it's all over the shop until you're stationary and idling (the oil is moving around in the reservoir) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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