IMS Bearing Problem

[PRW]

Hi fellow Porsche owners

Can anyone advise a mechanic in Sydney who has done the LN Engineering IMS bearing upgrade.

Bob Whymms has been suggested but would like to see if there are any others.

Thanks

[JustJames]

Hi PRW

Ahem!

I may not be entirely impartial, but you could call Autohaus Hamilton on 9905 1455 and speak to Tim.

James

[PCM911T]

If you are in Canberra, you could also talk to the Head technician at Gulson Porsche in Fyshwick. (used to be Mark). Porsche Club Canberra may also have suggestions.

[Niko]

Found this on another forum for those wanting to know how the IMS bearing is replaced. YouTube clip

PORSCHE 911 Carrera 996 IMS BEARING replacement video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?V=hAxj6FKMzvM&feature=YouTube_gdata_player

[sydr]

Autohaus did great work for me, built this:

They've transformed my car, I'm well pleased.

[Niko]

I have just found a poll on the 986 forum from the US.

Question was...has your Boxster sustained a IMS failure requiring engine replacement.

Answers 43 replies NO.

04 replies YES

Looks like it is probably not as prevalent problem as the forums seem to say it is.

However many replies had said, while the car was getting other engine work done the IMS bearing was replaced even though there had been no problems with it.

Anyway mine is in at JOCARO's at the moment being done as preventative medicine.

[Chris-p]

Good idea Niko. Something you don't have to worry about then...

C

[T-Man]

That's still a 10% failure rate Niko!

Prevention is better than a cure!

[Niko]

Yep your right Theo, 10% is still a bit scarey, and knowing my luck .....

Anyway all going well, the job is done and I won't be stressing over each little forum report on IMS failures.

Now.....what else can I find on the forums to make me lose sleep.....

[Guest vas930]

Nico, whats the cost for this fix?

[withers]

I'm also interested to know what the cost is. If I do go for a 996 (so undecided) then I'll get this done ASAP too

[Niko]

Nico, whats the cost for this fix?

Just picked the car up and final account was $1927.35. That included supplying the bearing, a rear main seal, a cover, flex plate bolt, top up of oil and coolant. Parts came to $977.35

Labour came to $950.00.

I can give you further detail if you want.

Regards, Niko

[Doish13]

You should pas on the mechanics details to JJ - didn't he just get charged up the proverbial ...

[Niko]

Happy to do that for JJ, if his proverbial is working again, or others interested. If they send me a pm.

[Guest vas930]

So, for 2k the whole issue goes away ?

[Niko]

So, for 2k the whole issue goes away ?

Yowsie Vas (I sure hope so anyway) and also the log book gets a nice sticker saying the IMS has been upgraded.

[Apogee]

Hi Niko,

Who did your IMS replacement?

thanks!

[928S4]

I think it was Jocaro?

[mikefocke]

Is the IMS problem real? Yes. Expensive if it happens to you.

 

All years? 986 and 987 yes to varying degrees.

 

How expensive?  Depends on the transmission. Tip are much more expensive than stick shift cars. Third gen IMS much much more. 3rd gen tip....ouch. Difference is in labor hours.

 

What can you do to prevent it? Not much.  You can lessen the odds somewhat by changing the oil much more often than Porsche recommends and using good stuff. Also by keeping the oil level spot on, not too low or too high. And by using the car as wear is worst when the bearing is just starting to turn. So long trips and higher revs once the engine has fully warmed up are thought to help circulate the oil into the bearing for the next start.

 

But luck and age are at play. Age in that the seal intended to keep greese in to lube the bearing breaks down over time due to heat.

 

There must be a dozen kits, bearings, approaches, solutions, etc advertised as the right thing to do. There is very little data on which ones work best because so many of the kits have so few installed for such a short time. And no one is going to run scientific tests.

 

LN has the most installed, 10k+ spread out over the three designs most being second generation.

 

Each of us has to figure out how much to spend on preventative maintenance, how much they can afford to spend if the worst happens. My answer might be the wrong one for you.

 

For a 2005, its a tough call. Are you in the 1% a year and replace the engine group? Or the much better odds group? Pull the trans and see.

 

Good luck.

[Niko]

Thanks Mike, always great to hear from you.

informative post and a qualified view on what is an ongoing and regrettable problem to an otherwise just about bullet proof car(s)

Also apologies to APOGEE, for late reply, 928s4 is correct, JOCARO AUTOMOTIVE, in Braeside replaced mine with the LN second gen bearing.

If you need any further details etc PM me and I will pass on info.

[Apogee]

Thanks Niko,

I didn't know you are in VIC. Unfortunately, I live in Sydney.

[Niko]

No worries Apogee, just James from Autohaus might be worth a phone call to point you in the right direction

Good luck with it.

[mikefocke]

For those who don't follow this issue on the several US and UK forums, let me offer a summary.

 

In the last year there are perhaps a dozen who have offered kits, just choosen a bearing out of a catalog, etc. Some with quite agressive marketing plans. Some will sell to anyone and trust that the amateur mechanic can make it work. Others, burned by prior bad experiences with those who can't or won't follow instructions, restrict their sales to authorized installers (at least they try to). Some of the bearings are quite different in design from what Porsche originally used. Flat bearings, roller bearings, etc. Some with an oil feed to the bearing.

 

Porsche settled a lawsuite over the failure of the 2nd generation single row bearings with some US customers and in the process admitted to a failure rate for those of about 1% per car per year. But that will probably increase as these cars are now getting on in age and many have passed through many owners and along the way an owner may have neglected their maintanance.

 

If you are doing an IMS as preventative maintenance to reduce risk, then you are faced with two important choices.  Who to do the work and what parts to buy.

 

Choose an experienced mechanic who has a good reputation. If you are spending that much to reduce risk, you want it done right, not by a first timer.

 

Of the parts available, the LN ceramic splash/mist lubricated kits are the ones that has been in the field the longest and which we know the most about. There are 12k of them running around in customer's cars, thousands for several years.  We aren't seeing failure reports in the 8 forums I read daily. 

 

But even the LN kit for the single row cars (US 2000-2005.5) has a limited life expectancy, though a much better one than the bearings Porsche originally used.

 

Some of the other kits are awfully new and thus the uncertainty leads to an unknown risk. Might be great, might not be.  Won't really know for several years.  I don't get excited about marketing claims, I've been disappointed too many times.

 

So for the most certainty of reducing risk now, it is probably the LN kit.  In a few years after we know more about some of these other approaches, that may not be true.

 

And there will be more kits coming.

[Niko]

Thank you, once again Mike. Your contributions on this issue are very informative and well received.

[withers]

Thanks Mike.. its all a bit of a worry thats for sure!  Ignorance can be bliss.

 

I dropped $3500 on my IMS Solution - so far so good. But I'd be lying if I said I've simply forgotten about it.  I haven't. Maybe that is why I sill find myself looking at 911s!