Prav Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 Dear PFA crew, This is my first post (joined this morning) and I am needing the advice of the wise before I complete the purchase of my first Porsche. Background: I am soon to be splitting my time between Melbourne and the ACT for work, I have spent much time being rational, considering newer "performance" cars from BMW, Merc, Audi, Subaru and so on. I already own a Renault RS 265. But my emotional side is winning and, now that I need a second car, I cannot get past the idea of a Porsche. I almost signed off on a new Subaru WRX... the appeal of a new car with warranty and so on was almost too hard to resist. Almost. But then, do I really want to be yet another boy racer..... Now, I am looking at a 2004 Boxster S Manual with a little under 80,000km on the odometer. It comes with an aftermarket warranty (assuming it is useless) and has been looked after by Gulson's, who say they have just serviced the car, changing the gearbox and clutch, and assure me it has no issues (sigh, dealers!). The car has a few scratches, has a Clarion aftermarket stereo, the leather is a bit crinkled and worn, it was a Queensland car but apparently has been well looked after..... Books still need to be checked. When I test drove the car, the idle was clean but there was a initial puff of blue/grey smoke when the ignition was turned on. Apart from that, the test drive revealed a car not as quick as my previous cars (eg BMW 135i Coupe) but I was seduced by beautiful, balanced dynamics, a tight clutch, sharp steering and the sense I could precisely steer it to hit a five cent piece on any apex...... I am looking at having the IMS fixed straight after purchase. So. Questions: 1) How reliable is this generation of Boxster? Are the KMs very high for this age / type of car? 2) Caveats? 3 Gulson's say it is only a couple of thousand to fix the IMS issue. Weltmeister in Melbourne are saying to allow $3500. Weltmeister are saying they no longer the LN ceramic bearing, rather some sort of device with a sleeve that negates the need for a bearing. How good are Weltmeister? Should I use them or Gulsons? Or Jocaro? Or someone else again? Canberra or Melbourne are options. 4) I have heard the 986 is one of Porsche's most reliable cars. Is this true? Do I gain much if I find another 20,000 dollars over 12 months and buy a newer (eg later 987) car? 5) Any other advice or comments? Thanks most kindly for taking the time. I'll look forward to hearing from you all. Prav Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ByronBayChris Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 Welcome I know nothing about Boxsters, and only a little more on 911. I would recommend Amanda's Boxster which has just come on the market IMS. has been done and she is a fanatic with the car........I wanted to buy it for my better half, but I was quickly.knocked down. I have used Jocaro for the 911 with success. Happy shopping Chris EDIT heres the link. Not an s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D'Silva Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 welcome to the forum... Whats your budget? I am assuming that if you were looking at a new WRX, you are around the $40-$50 mark. A 986 S boxster is a nice car... but when you move to the 987 Series, everything is just a bit more modern inside. The dash is much nicer and the fit and finish is a lot less "rattly". I'd take a 987 standard Boxster over a 986S any day. However, the 986 is still a reliable car. As long as it has good service history and regular/frequent oil changes, you should be good to go. The puff of smoke at start up is quite normal depending on how long the car has sat. It should only be the initial bit of smoke and after 2 seconds running, should be totally clear. Any more than that, and you could have problems. When you say they changed the gearbox and clutch, does that mean it has a new gearbox?? that would be strange. Did they change the rear main seal RMS at the same time? How much are they asking for it? Post up a link so we can have a look. Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prav Posted 2March, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 Thanks Chris and Mike. I really have my heart set on an S. Having driven the 2.7 and the 3.2, the 3.2 came alive a little more for me. The specific car can be found here. http://www.porschecentrecanberra.com.au/Used-Porsche-Detail3.aspx?vehicleId=2700&model=BOXSTER&make=PORSCHE&year=2004&price=%200.0000&colour=ATLAS%20GREYBLACK&bodyType=%202D%20ROADSTER Cheers, Prav Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony1 Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 I would just check when it left QLD I looked at few from up there that were water damaged from the floods, check the floor under the carpets to be certain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TINGY Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 Don't just look at one, go and have a look at as many as you can, get a good feel for them and do your homework on the model you desire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyS Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 Hi prav, ims upgrade is must to factor in. Nicko has his boxter S done at jocaro and I did my 996 911 done at Autoart. Both about the same cost, 2K with minor service give or take. Amanda has had the newer 'oil feed' solution fitted to her boxter, she will will be able to fill you in for cost etc. advice would be to drive a few different variaties, older S, newer 2.7 etc then make the call that suits you. good luck. AndyS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baso Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 I will throw my 2 cents worth in. I bought my 986 S (2003 model year) around 12 months or so ago and have been completely happy with the car. I have around 60km on mine, but this seems to be very much at the lower end - I would think 80km is probably still a bit less than average for km for a 2004 car. There are a lot of cars with well over 100km on them. I did the usual research (except this forum) when looking for a Boxster and came to the view I wanted an S, but my budget did not stretch to considering the 987 as an option. I agree the interior of the 986 is not the best that Porsche has done - some of the plastics and materials are a bit cheap and the look of the dash is not necessarily my cup of tea. That said, for a 12 year old car, there rate no rattles, squeaks from the interior and every thing works. There are some minor scratches on the scuff plates and the usual plastic peeling on the arm rests on the door. But apart from that, it is fine. Mechanically I had not had any issues with my car at all. I had a PPI done before I bought the car (something I would definitely suggest) that revealed a few things, but all typical Boxster stuff for the age - suspension bits and pieces and engine mount - had them all fixed as part of my first service of the car. In terms of the puff of smoke at start up, I understand this can be a common Boxster thing - there is another thread on this. Clutch at 80km seems about right from what I understand but not sure about the gearbox. I was given an indication of about $4k for clutch and IMS so I guess as a stand alone the difference would largely be the cost of the clutch. I assume that combining both means only the one labour charge which may be why the prices are quite close. On the IMS note - there is enough on various forums to suggest it is an issue to be aware of. Everyone will have a view on whether to get it done straight away - I will do mine at the same time as a get the clutch done which will end up being between 18 and 24 months after I bought the car. Looking at the car you indicated, the price seems to be a bit above the general asking price, especially in Sydney. If Gulsens is offering the warranty, as a Porsche dealer you would hope they would stand by it. I do agree with comments above - take the time to look for the right (and best) car - I spent 12 months until the car I was happy with came along. Other random points: - size of wheel is a personal thing. I have 17in, some suggest going bigger does compromise the ride a bit - the bose stereo upgrade is apparently worth while (you not note there is an after market in the one you are looking at). The stock unit is not great - check what options the car has. As a second hand proposition they will not add much to the price of the car - cost of ownership is pretty reasonable. Service costs are comparable to some Japanese brands (thinking Subaru). If something does break, it will cost more, but it is a performance car I know that is all bit long winded, so in summary - I have been completely happy with the S, never had any reliability issues and (based on the last service) not expecting any imminent mechanical issues. Hope some of that is of use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 The 2.7 987 is as quick as the 986 S variant. The 987 drives and handles superiorly to all 986s. You need to drive them all. $3500 Weltmeister will offer the permanent IMS solution which fixes the issue for good. My car has this and is rock solid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GC9911 Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 If you can stump up the extra money go the 987 IMHO. You should buy as much Porsche as you can afford, especially as you appear to be leaning to the newer cars. unless you are looking at an air cooled classic & I am no expert in these matters, there are others here who have great knowledge & experience. agree with Tingy above, drive as many as you can before you decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveT Posted 2March, 2014 Report Share Posted 2March, 2014 Smoke at start is more than likely a valve called an Air Oil Separator (AOS). It's worth a couple of hundred dollars to buy and similar to have fitted apparently. My 987 does the same, blows blueish smoke on startup but not all the time. If you were replacing the IMS bearing you would only have the price of the AOS to add as they could easily fit this whilst doing the rest of that job. Have a look at a few cars, there are always quite a few Porsches for sale and good luck with your search and purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qstoria Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Welcome to the forum Prav, $42,990 for a 986 S is a ridiculous asking price in this market, even for a dealer. If you have that sort of money then you should be considering a 987. Hell you might even find a 987 S for not much more than that. I would say that car is more in the 30-35 bracket at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion03 Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Why not look at the 996 instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Welcome to the forum Prav, $42,990 for a 986 S is a ridiculous asking price in this market, even for a dealer. If you have that sort of money then you should be considering a 987. Hell you might even find a 987 S for not much more than that. I would say that car is more in the 30-35 bracket at best. for $10 more buy Amanda's car - it's had all the work done (including the best IMS solution) and get In it and drive it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 for $10 more buy Amanda's car - it's had all the work done (including the best IMS solution) and get In it and drive it Yeh buy mine - might as well rip off the band aid quickly..... mycar by mmanda withers, on Flickr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ByronBayChris Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Buy Amanda's. I'm sure you won't regret it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qstoria Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Drop your price $10 dollars Amanda... I wish I only had to drop my price by that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Drop your price $10 dollars Amanda... I wish I only had to drop my price by that! Still no luck eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qstoria Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Still no luck eh? Amanda I did have luck in selling it - just not much luck in getting the price I wanted and truly believe it is worth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Really sorry to hear that qstoria - oh well, move onwards and upwards hey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddy Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Amanda, your car is beautiful. It is hard to let her go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prav Posted 3March, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 Dear All, Thanks for your wise words and advice. It's really helping. Amanda - your car is gorgeous and I am sure you will find the right buyer for such a lovely machine. Unfortunately, I have S on the brain. Cannot help myself. After much research and thinking, it seems increasingly wise to buy a 987. For about the same monthly payment, I can get into a 2006 Cayman S 987 with around 50,000 on the odo. The only question is whether I can still have the IMS fixed? Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustJames Posted 3March, 2014 Report Share Posted 3March, 2014 ... For about the same monthly payment, I can get into a 2006 Cayman S 987 with around 50,000 on the odo. The only question is whether I can still have the IMS fixed? Any thoughts? The Cayman will have the later M97 motor which has a beefier IMS bearing than the M96 engined cars. From memory, the very earliest 987/997 cars still have the M96 engine but by the time the Cayman was released, cars were all being fitted with the M97 motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qstoria Posted 4March, 2014 Report Share Posted 4March, 2014 Unless you must have a roadster then a Cayman S is the way to go if mechanically it is sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prav Posted 4March, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 4March, 2014 But doesn't the M97 engine still have IMS issues and have the double deuce of not being cureable? So, the M96 engine being the way to go if factoring in the IMS upgrade? Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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