Is a PPI really worth it? (996).

[Jim45]

If it can't reveal if the IMS has an issue (996 - seems to be the major concern) and everything else checks out - service history / receipts for work done etc. what's the point? Piece of mind ? Not sure the centre preparing the PPI are liable in any way so sounds like a money pit to be honest.  I've driven a car I like this weekend - it went well / looks well maintained inside and out / stops and idles properly - has a warranty - what the hell else is there besides telling me that the clip that holds the fuel flap open needs replacing.....

Jim.

[hugh]

If it's been in a major accident is usually a big one unless you know what to look for. Generally, a professional is gong to be able give you a good 'picture' of where the cars at, wear on major components etc. 

for a few hundred $$$ it's worth getting another opinion, the alternative can be much more costly. Up to you, if you've already made your mind up just buy it! 

[SteveF]

Hi Jim,

In my opinion I think it is worthwhile getting a Porsche specialist to look over any car you are looking at buying. Even if you are comfortable with service history etc. and it does indeed check out, you will have piece of mind but also know what possible items are in need of replacement in the future. Then you can budget accordingly. On the flipside a PPI may uncover something that you didn't pick up and it would have potentially saved you thousands. Each to their own I suppose but the fact that you have a warranty on this one is also a bonus.  Good luck with the search.

Steve

[Rod C]

Are the doors and windows operating as they should?....9 micro switches in each door alone,wear left on rotors and pads,that sticking ignition barrel should that feel like that? Just a small example that only experience can answer.

[Jim45]

Cheers guys - I'm not an expert, was just after opinion really.

I did discuss what the current owner thought needed doing over the next 18months / 2 Years - Rotors and pads came up.

I did notice a whine when on the power in 6th gear but it was intermittent and could have even been road noise. Happened 2 - 3 times for a couple of seconds only. (I drove the car for 1 hour plus). I tried to find the noise by accelerating and decelerating but couldn't artificially reproduce it.

This may sway me towards a PPI as I want to know if it's gearbox related.

Jim.

[Mike737]

Depends on how well you know 996's and if you've got the tools and a thorough checklist you can go through on the car.

Things that you might not be able to do is compression & vacuum checks, engine diagnostic readouts and bore scope (if you included it in the PPI).

The PPI might just identify one item which you might not have picked up and should almost instantly justify the cost.

 

I did notice a whine when on the power in 6th gear but it was intermittent and could have even been road noise. Happened 2 - 3 times for a couple of seconds only. (I drove the car for 1 hour plus). I tried to find the noise by accelerating and decelerating but couldn't artificially reproduce it.

This is a bit of a long shot, but was the stereo unit on? The stock stereo seems to have this weird thing where it makes a whine with the RPM which is probably to do with the electrical load. You can diagnose it by switching the stereo to AUX and turning up the volume. Otherwise if the whole stereo unit is off and it does it, then that's not it.

[Skidmarks]

I'd never buy without one. They are so useful if you want to do a little negotiating.  

[tazzieman]

I'm wondering if people are getting PPIs on non P cars of a certain vintage? Is there a point where sale price vs PPI price doesn't make sense?

Does expertise within a car club make a difference? Or is PFA as good if not better in this regard? During ownership of these modern classics almost certainly new issues will pop up, but I suspect most are readily diagnosable , if not treatable at home.

Just wondering out loud!

[Mike737]

I'm wondering if people are getting PPIs on non P cars of a certain vintage? Is there a point where sale price vs PPI price doesn't make sense?

Interesting point Tazzie. I would think it would be as soon as you have an engine or gearbox which isn't cheap then you would. Eg. My civics engine + gearbox can be bought for less than 3k second hand. Good luck getting those for 20k all up on the 996.

I can't imagine many people who buy Ferrari's, Lamorghinis or other exotics would not get them checked out by a mechanic.

[tazzieman]

So you could get a partial PPI (PPPI) just to check the big $ items? Makes sense.

[ANF]

Do you have access to a hoist? There could be telling signs not to mention oil leaks that you may not see.....

I'm wondering if people are getting PPIs on non P cars of a certain vintage? Is there a point where sale price vs PPI price doesn't make sense?

Take our own backyard (Tassie - much more choice on the north island).... where would you take a 928 (like I just bought) for a PPI and have confidence that they knew what they were looking for? Same could be said of most classics and older cars....

[tazzieman]

Take our own backyard (Tassie - much more choice on the north island).... where would you take a 928 (like I just bought) for a PPI and have confidence that they knew what they were looking for? 

Who did you take yours too 

[ANF]

Some tyre smoking dude.....

On a car like a 996 I would most certainly obtain a PPI, just not sure where would go locally...

[Coastr]

Just getting it up on a hoist and getting compression tests can be very valuable.  Things like leaking/weeping fluids, underbody damage, rusty/crushed exhUsts,  overspray from repairs etc etc are very valuable.  A car with 70% compression in one cylinder will still idle and drive well.  The 996 also is known for RMS issues.

i bought a car once that would never have passed 15 minutes on the hoist.  But I bought it because I was in a hurry and I liked the look of it.  Even having a second opinion to throw a cold bucket of reality is worth it.  I spent many hours and thousands of $$ correcting issues which were obvious if you got underneath.  I may have still bought the car but it would have been at a lot lower price, with the documented list of things needing attention.

Best thing to do is to negotiate exactly what you want looked at, so they don't spend 30 minutes testing the interior buttons (you can do that) but instead work to a fixed price looking at things in descending order of priority.  If they run out of time it's likely they found something bigger higher up the list, which will tell you all you need to know.

The car purchase I was most happy about was when I researched the model extensively, wrote myself out a two-page checklist and went through it all, one by one.  The dealer laughed at me and tried to embarrass me into stopping but I gave him the cold stare and went about my business.  I found a couple of things which cost them to put right (things like worn door rubber) and thus I eliminated niggles and was happy with the purchase.

so my recommendation is to get a long list of things to check for a 996, check off the ones you can do yourself, and pay someone to get it on a hoist to check the others.

[qstoria]

PPI for sure.  A 996 is what, $50k give or take at the moment?

Don't risk spoiling what could be one of the most satisfying experiences of your life by skimping on a few hundred bucks.  Plus when the PPI comes back positive then you will have that extra satisfaction.

[tazzieman]

PPI for sure.  A 996 is what, $50k give or take at the moment?

Don't risk spoiling what could be one of the most satisfying experiences of your life by skimping on a few hundred bucks.  Plus when the PPI comes back positive then you will have that extra satisfaction.

The problem lies when there are several cars that strike the eye. How many PPIs are too many? It's like househunting (something I've never done). It all adds up!

[Pork Chops]

2 of the last 3 cars I bought I got a PPI done in preference to the cost of flying interstate. Bought them site unseen which worked OK. In both cases the results of the PPI formed significant part of the purchase discussion. Without exaggerating if you get caught out with an unseen yet significant issue it could cost on the tens of thousands to fix. Would always get a PPI personally. 3rd car I bought from a friend in the trade and was / is a peach.

[symsy]

With so many bidding now days  with your  PPI , maybe you could just post that your results are for sale  to recoup monies in a multi car sutuation 

Just a thought ….

I would PPI , worth the money in my experience unless you got a Bargain and then have a buffer to do work or you know your cgonna hot rod etc and go through the car anyway.

Lots of 996 parts from wroteoffs available 

[Jim45]

Depends on how well you know 996's and if you've got the tools and a thorough checklist you can go through on the car.

Things that you might not be able to do is compression & vacuum checks, engine diagnostic readouts and bore scope (if you included it in the PPI).

The PPI might just identify one item which you might not have picked up and should almost instantly justify the cost.

 

This is a bit of a long shot, but was the stereo unit on? The stock stereo seems to have this weird thing where it makes a whine with the RPM which is probably to do with the electrical load. You can diagnose it by switching the stereo to AUX and turning up the volume. Otherwise if the whole stereo unit is off and it does it, then that's not it.

Cheers for the input - stereo was off..

Reviewed the service history etc and receipts today - says the IMS was postponed when clutch changed a year ago. Will have a word with mechanic tomorrow see why he thought that did not need doing.

Jim.

 

[dan_189]

PPI saved me from buying a very un-sorted MK2 996 import as well as saving me a flight to see it, $500 very well spent 

 

Also looks good in the documentation to have a PPI for the next owner IMO

[smit2100]

+1 Particularly when

1) after the seller gives you there PPI, you ask as a buyer, have you had any of those items fixed on the PPI.   (If mechanicals aren't fixed / servicing further delayed  = hmmm)

2) Shows that a good set of compression and cyclinder leak down test numbers at one point in time can go south pretty quickly if the current owner didn't maintain it or treat it well or was unlucky whilst they had the keys on their watch in a relatively short period of time.

As I see it, PPI is money well spend given:

1) Demonstrates you are a serious buyer.  Not convinced a sane buyer person would drop circa $400 to $900 a PPI for the privilege of pissing a seller about.

2) High probability you have the rosy "P" goggles on and your probability of premature ejaculation is a lot higher than someone who has more experience having gone through/ had their fair share of "P"'.  But you need to ensure you have it on good authority that the selected PPI workshop / tech going the report have actually gone through / had their fair share of "P".

3) Coupled with a quote (costs you nothing) on what it costs to fix items found, given your already tight state of mind having dropped coin on a PPI, basic common sense would have you going into a deal with a starting negotiating position that a  price discussed before committing to the PPI (could be the advertised) less what you dropped on the PPI is the maximum your expect to / will pay.  At the other end, with PPI in hand, you need to at least start with a deduct (from previously discussed amount) the cost to fix the non shit bit items in the PPI (give seller a copy) and need to nicely point out with direct references to their add:  Excellent now only good.   Good down to fair.  Fair down to got a spend some coin to get this up to scratch.

If the PPI shows there was not one bit of information on it that you didn't already know and their was noting wrong with it,  you paid circa $700 for some motivation to buy it straightaway and consider it a downpayment on not having those , woulda, shoulda, conversions with yourself after some other punter takes it before you. I am sure circa $700 is worth the smile on your dial when you just get to see it parked in the garage, let alone driving it in and out instead of wasting time still looking for one

PS A PPI was the best $700 dollars I spent this year and will be the best return I see this year on any investment I make.  Eg a x20 banger / bagger.  Eg After covering the cost of the PPI, I saved myself from having to more than likely fork out 20 times the PPI price in addition to my purchase price to bring the car up scratch that I was none the wiser about had I not had a full PPI done.