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Help! What's this worth?

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Hi All, 

I'm new to this forum and looking into purchasing my first Porsche. 

I have a family member looking to sell their 1998/99 911 Carrera (996) coupe.

The vehicle has a tad over 300,000kms on the odometer however is in amazing condition inside and out. The current owner is has owned the vehicle for approximately 15 years and has kept all service receipts since purchased.

In the time that he has owned the vehicle he has rebuilt the automatic transmission, replaced the water pump and drive belts, various parts of the suspension, carried out all relevant services required along with general wear and tear items. The only item that hasn't been replaced yet is the IMS bearing. 

I've been asked to make him an offer, something I feel is fair and reasonable. 

I feel that is a good opportunity to purchase my dream weekend at what could be a great price. 

What are your thoughts? 

Cheers! 

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 Hey mate, welcome 

That's pretty big kilometres in my opinion, and considering a 2001 model I knew of, black on black in very good condition with 118,000km /auto (tiptronic) with a full service history sold for $35k not long ago, I'd say maybe $25k tops?  Some may say even less due to the higher mileage, as that scares people off as it would me, and I'd probably offer even less personally. 

 Keep in mind that if the IMS hasnt disintegrated by now, its either you're safe, or it's a potential time bomb waiting to happen and I'd have it replaced, so factor in $3500-4000 for that at a shop. I hate to be the first to say it as it's your family member selling it, but for peace of mind I'd get a pre purchase inspection done by a reputable shop to do a compression check, because if it's on it's way out and you need to rebuild or replace the engine, you're up for some serious coin which will ruin the dream of Porsche ownership and murder your wallet! 

 With all the negatives out of the way, once you do own a Porsche there is no looking back, as they're not just a car, but an experience every time you drive them or just look at them in the garage 

 Good luck, and I'm sure we all hope you it turns out ok

 

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2 hours ago, LeeM said:

because if it's on it's way out

 

At 300k most of the life of the engine is gone.   You need to buy at a big discount because the car has a rebuild in its future.  I would price how much a replacement engine is and factor that into purchase price.   If it were me I would start in the high teens and work your way from there.  The wholesale / trade value of a 300k 911 is not high, and there are lots of nice ones for sale.

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Welcome to the forum!

A quick squiz on Carsales. There are currently 14 auto 996 coupe's for sale (excluding 4 and 4S) ranging from $39,490 - $57,888 with km's ranging from 76,200 - 226,000 km's. However 300,000+km's is quite high for a 996 so definitely would be at a significant discount.  There are examples of some 996's that seem to go forever.

Here's a 500,000+ 996:

Here's a 389K km 996:

https://jalopnik.com/i-dyno-tested-my-1999-porsche-911-with-243-000-miles-1788130306

That being said, I would be getting a compression test at the very least and if that looks good then perhaps Lee's suggestion of mid 20K tops.  Keep in mind that a new engine or rebuilt engine is big $$ and a short term win on the price may turn in to much bigger $$ long term.

 

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Depends .. a few things to consider.  Highway or city kms?  Compression test?  Oil analysis? (Nulon do one for $39).  Do any engine rattles / clatter fade within ~ 30seconds from cold start as the lifters and cam chain tensioners fill up?

Mines closing in on 200,000 km (194,500ish) and recent oil analysis showed no wear issues (early 1999 model)

This is an entertaining read about a high-miler 996, but to be fair the owner has a business maintaining old F1 cars.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=47&t=1601182

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IMO offer 20 pay 23 and keep it for a year and sell at 23 (which you will get) and then pay a bit more for a better one with lower ks. ATM he wouldn't get more than 25 for a sale within a month on CS (maybe 28 if he held out for 9 months)  ….. and this depends on the info provided. There's a lot of not mentioned factors that would affect a buyers price.

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There's always the possibility that one of the less mileage cars  that are 30-40k could have their engine die at any point - for whatever reason.

That means even though you bought a more expensive / lower mile car - you might need an engine rebuild anyway at some point in the near future.

So, if you buy this car for $20k-ish, even if the engine requires a rebuild at some point - for the same price as one of the lower Km cars, you're getting a rebuilt engine included!
(glass is half full here!)

Obviously other parts on the car would have worn (transmission?) during the 300k km's - but just a different way to look at it. 

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Thanks for the replies all.

Think i might start with a compression test and a RWC inspection just to get an idea of the upfront cost that might be near.

As mentioned above the car has had its gearbox rebuilt within the last two years which cost the previous owner $10.8k. I feel that the only other item of high costs that may fail is the engine. IMS being the main concern however the car has traveled over 300km's with no problems.....YET! 

I did read on another forum that someone said IMS bearings were more prone to fail in vehicle built from 2000 on wards! Any truth? 

Either way my plan would be to keep the vehicle for 6-12 months, see if i like it and potentially sell it off and look at something slight newer.

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Yes being an 'early' 996.1 it should have the dual row IMSB (found in 1998, 1999 models and some of 2000 apparently) which are generally considered to be less failure-prone compared with the later single row versions.  

Agree with the somewhere in the low-mid twenties estimates above.  

 

 

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Trying to potentially sell it off in the near future might pose a bit of a headache and drawn out process - unless its really keenly priced.  nuying off a family member is fine, there's an element of trust and knowing..  Selling a 300k + car to a stranger is a different game again.  IMO

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If you were planning on keeping it a long time I would say go for it and enjoy, but as you say you may only keep it for 6 to 12 months, I have to agree with @WOKA

In that case I would avoid it as you would find it hard to sell with what has been said above, people are in fear of higher km cars..... wait for something that you really want!

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Save a bit more money and get something better.

Aussies for better or worse are km phobic when it comes to cars. You'll find it very difficult to sell because of the 300k+ kms at any price.

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I think I kind of agree with the above.. If a 300+km car came up for sale, I’d probably scoff at it thinking it would be a horrendous money pit. If my best mate was selling me a car that had done those ks and the price was right I’d buy it knowing I’d be selling it one day for scrap. 

For a short term hold I wouldn’t, long term hold I would. In saying that if you pass I’d be interested as I’d be buying for long term fun

btw, there was a 2003 C4S that just sold with over 200,000ks for about $45k, but that had a rebuilt engine 

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If there are very few with low/medium k's then you would buy.

996 Autos in good nick with reasonable kms are not hard to find.  So get one of those.  Or get it real cheap and have fun, then sell it real cheap to someone else.  But I mean $20k cheap.

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It'd be something that I'd leap at for long term at 20k. Drive it with a wrecker replacement engine in mind. Then drive it some more. If you ever actually needed it. 

If you feel you had to resell it i wouldn't bother buying it. 

No bias as i don't have 20k spare atm.

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