Peter M Posted 19August, 2014 Report Share Posted 19August, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 19August, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 19August, 2014 Peter well done. Seems each time I read this I realise I may not have found all the maps yet. Graeme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 20August, 2014 Report Share Posted 20August, 2014 I wonder how much of the 996 tiptronic programming is in the 964/993? (found this on one of my CD's at home) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 20August, 2014 Report Share Posted 20August, 2014 Russ,I suspect the 996 programming is just a refinement of the 993 programming that was just a refinement of the 964 programming and looking at your diagram has all the same inputs and logic. Probably the biggest difference is the extra gear that the 996's got over the 964/993's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 27August, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 27August, 2014 There is a small section in Bruce Anderson's book Porsche 911 Performance handbook 3rd edittion on page 267-268 about the Tiptronic and S version. He makes the observation that "Tapping the selector twice in rapid sucession (in manual mode) caused the transmission to shift down two gears in one motion. As soon as the engine speed limit was reached, the transmission would automatically shift up with out any action on the part of the driver" This fits in with what i have found and I am sure other owners have also found is, put the can in Manual select 1st gear and stand on the Throttle..... Cheers Graeme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ByronBayChris Posted 29August, 2014 Report Share Posted 29August, 2014 put the can in Manual select 1st gear and stand on the Throttle.... C So can't we just delete this entire thread and use this post as the final conclusion to tiptronic Scott930 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 29August, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 29August, 2014 Like you thinking and agree. However the entire basis behind this thread was to gather and explore as much information about Tiptronic gearboxes due to the rather scant info that Porsche released. I have not seen on any other website thats assembled whats on this thread, and so far I feel there is still more to be dicovered/learnt. cheers Graeme Chris-p 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonk Posted 1September, 2014 Report Share Posted 1September, 2014 Hey guys. Have any of you come across any aftermarket tuning software that allows the tuner to modify the speed of gear changes. I'm happy with the auto mode and the 5 or 6 different shift patterns (although I still get frustrated with it sometimes) but I'd like it to change gears quicker in manual mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 1September, 2014 Report Share Posted 1September, 2014 If you find out the way to force the gearbox ECU into a particular mode 'straight off' let us know! I know a few people that are trying to find out that info for their boxster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 1September, 2014 Report Share Posted 1September, 2014 Hey guys. Have any of you come across any aftermarket tuning software that allows the tuner to modify the speed of gear changes. I'm happy with the auto mode and the 5 or 6 different shift patterns (although I still get frustrated with it sometimes) but I'd like it to change gears quicker in manual mode. au-yt, ByronBayChris and Peter M 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonk Posted 1September, 2014 Report Share Posted 1September, 2014 deleted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonk Posted 1September, 2014 Report Share Posted 1September, 2014 If you find out the way to force the gearbox ECU into a particular mode 'straight off' let us know! I know a few people that are trying to find out that info for their boxster I'm thinking somewhere like Fitzgerald Racing would be able to do it if it can be done. They do dyno tuning and ECU remapping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 3September, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 3September, 2014 There is a guy on RENNLIST who has put the car in manual and locked it there, covered the gear change to look a manual and drives it as such. The wise words of universal laws are spt on and I can relate to them. I have a long running non porsche "recreation, restoration" and the laws are very previlant. One thing I am fully aware of is the guys at the factory are definately not idiots, however time and technoligy have moved on. AS for software, not for the 993 but there appears to be some for the 996. http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/996-turbo-gt2/252113-tiptronic-software-upgrade.html but this has mixed comments and suggestion to RennTech https://www.facebook.com/pages/RENNtech/108297569234488?sk=info&ref=page_internal I will follow this up when I get home. Graeme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctb Posted 8September, 2014 Report Share Posted 8September, 2014 Mike From what I have read the actual transmission are the same, programs I am not so sure. I would be interested to read what 964 owner’s experiences are. The key difference with the 993 S is the switches on the steering wheel. Graeme My 1990 964 does behave similarly with one big exception, it will not hold first gear if you lift off the throttle at anything higher than 2000rpm. It will change up at redline but unlike other gears it will change to 2nd no matter what is you lift off the throttle in any way at any rpm above 2000. ctb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 9September, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 9September, 2014 Interesting insight thankyou. I will try that with mine. I wonder if a 964 Tiptronic can be upgraded to an S spec with a ecu change? Graeme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 22September, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 22September, 2014 As strange as it sounds I read the Owners Manual.... doing things backwards as usual.............. There is tucked away in the text the following..bear with me as we have covered some of this but to keep in context. Automatic Gear Selection Gate The gear-change characteristics are influenced by the accelerator pedal position, vehicle road speed, engine speed as well as longitudinal and transverse acceleration values and the topographical profile. There are five different gear-changing maps available, ranging from "economy" to "sport". The speed-changing points can shift to higher or lower engine speeds, depending on the way the vehicle is driven. Changing up before bends in the road is prevented by quick throttle reduction. Depending on the lateral acceleration, the gears do not change up in curves until the engine speed limit has been reached.... By quickly depressing the accelerator pedal (from about 54 km/h I 34 mph upwards) the transmission will change to the most sporty speed-changing map, i.e. to the maximum number of speed-changing points. Accordingly, the transmission changes down immediately by one or two gears. Deactivating the function: Release the accelerator pedal decisively (by about 25%). Depending on the lateral acceleration, the gears do not change up in curves until the engine speed limit has been reached.... By quickly depressing the accelerator pedal (from about 54 km/h I 34 mph upwards) the transmission will change to the most sporty speed-changing map, i.e. to the maximum number of speed-changing points. Accordingly, the transmission changes down immediately by one or two gears. Deactivating the function: Release the accelerator pedal decisively (by about 25%). Kick down For optimum acceleration e.g. when overtaking, the accelerator pedal must be depressed be yond the full throttle (kick down) point. Depending on the speed selector lever position and road speed, the transmission will change down to the lowest possible transmission speed. Selection of the next speed up will only take place at higher engine speeds. The engine speeds necessary for speed changes during kick down will remain active until the accelerator pedal depression is reduced to 50 % of throttle position. Graeme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D'Silva Posted 25September, 2014 Report Share Posted 25September, 2014 I am starting to get to grips with this transmission and start to appreciate it... However I'm guessing the fluid has never been changed.. I've got a new filter, gasket, and pan gasket ready to go on... Just need to figure out what sort of ATF and how much I will need. Not wanting to spark a war like on the oil threads, but does it matter too much? mineral, semisyn, full syn.. ???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 25September, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 25September, 2014 Mike, I share you pain with "oil argument"! The transmission from what I have read, has two oil sections, the gearbox and Torque converter. The hand book has an oil spec and transmissions tend to be fussy about oils so I would stick to the oil spec. Cairns Modern Classic Porsche did my last service following a PPI. If you get stuck finding a local oil give them a call. As a side note I have emailed RUF to see if they had done any up grade modes to the Trans, but I am yet to hear from them..... Graeme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 27September, 2014 Report Share Posted 27September, 2014 Mike,According to the driver's manual:Transmission takes approximately 9 litres of ATF- Dexron IID (Dexron II was GM's standard until 1993 when it was replaced by Dexron III. Now Dexron III was replaced by the current standard Dexron VI in 2005. While previous Dexrons were backwards compatible, the current standard has slightly less hot viscosity . I guess read the bottle label!)Differential takes approximately 0.9 litres of SAE 75W-90 gear oil of API Classification GL5 (or Mil-L 2105B)As for brand and type, just use your favourite.Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
au-yt Posted 1November, 2014 Author Report Share Posted 1November, 2014 Weekend traffic in Sydney is beyond awful, enough whinging, Went to visit a friend who is debating the sale of his 89 G50 coupe, Driving home 35 degrees and air works well and car not fussed, there is a bypass near my place I took the opportunity to experiment more with the gearbox in auto the quick kick down, and a >25% prod, got one gear change at 90Ks so I thought what else so a quick push to full throttle second gear =:4,800, now that gets a bit exciting , I waited to see how long it would hold the gear before changing and it was long enough, 20 seconds holding the revs, so that I backed of the throttle and the car changed gear. It almost like the car gets a spike of adrenalin and wants’ to fight, where most autos want to flight. I do like this 993. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragon02 Posted 6January, 2015 Report Share Posted 6January, 2015 Just found this thread...did not know the hidden secrets of the tip! Graeme/Peter - is the throttle control only present in late models 993 or present in all 993 tips? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 6January, 2015 Report Share Posted 6January, 2015 Present in all 993 Tips and the same in 964's I believe as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f3nr15 Posted 2February, 2015 Report Share Posted 2February, 2015 Some guys on Rennlist are fitting a paddle-shifter kit - http://rennlist.com/forums/964-forum/818238-works-bell-964-paddle-shifter.html ByronBayChris 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 3February, 2015 Report Share Posted 3February, 2015 Transmission Fluid According to the driver's manual: Transmission takes approximately 9 litres of ATF- Dexron IID (Dexron II was GM's standard until 1993 when it was replaced by Dexron III. Now Dexron III was replaced by the current standard Dexron VI in 2005. While previous Dexrons were backwards compatible, the current standard has slightly less hot viscosity . I guess read the bottle label!) As for brand and type, just use your favourite. Cheers Since that earlier post, I've done a flush of my transmission so have done a bit more research on fluid types. Just to add to the above, ZF, the manufacturers of the 4HP22HL transmissions in these cars currently recommend on their website either: 1) Mineral ATF oils that meet General Motor's former Dexron II/III specification or 2) ATF oils that meet their TE - ML11 Classes 11A (normal change interval) or 11B (which are an extended interval type that are all synthetic from what I can see) specification and actually list brands of oil on their website that they endorse. Of the brands they list not many are commonly available in Australia except for the 11B types of Castrol Transmax Z, ZF Lifeguardfluid 5 and Pentosin ATF1 So there is plenty of choice at Repco and Supercheap Auto for either mineral or synthetic fluids that clearly state they meet the Dexron III specification and therefore our earlier II spec as well. Again I think pick your favourite brand as really it doesn't matter. What did I use? Castrol Transmax Z because it's on the ZF list but next time Castrol Transmax Multi-vehicle which is also full synthetic, meets the Dexron II/III spec but half the price! Oh, by the way, a simple drain, filter change and refill will take about 3.5 litres. My old oil was like new - bright, transparent and sweet smelling - so all good. The other thing I've learnt is that Porsche/ZF changed the sight glass on post '95 cars to provide an additional 0.5 litre of fluid capacity. This resulted in a recommendation that the Max 80C level in pre '95 cars be "overfilled" by 15mm for the same result. The attached jpegs of the factory workshop manual explains this change in detail. I simply remarked my old style sight glass with a fine marker pen which made it much easier to see what was what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Hervé Posted 22May, 2021 Report Share Posted 22May, 2021 On 14/07/2014 at 11:55, au-yt said: Peter More great info, thank you again and this helps identify the functions of the various components. The owners hand book also has an overview of the functions which are also helpful but not as descriptive as I would have thought. A description of each mode would help. There appears to be 4 angles of the throttle that effect the ECU 25% 30% and 100%. kick down. It measure how quickly you move the throttle both down and up and how far but in some modes will kick down to the lowest gear the ECU sees appropriate for the rpm. I read this as when driving spiritedly on open roads at legal speeds it should kick down to 2nd gear… Fun things identified so far, the rev protection part of the Manual mode makes for a bit of fun. Select Manual mode. 1st gear selected floor throttle and hold 6800 into second 6800 into third and you are in 6 points territory... too easy. Place and location withheld. Back to more serious things the temp sensor on the gearbox is interesting in that it changes the shift points to cool the box, and this may be why in some cases the car appears to match the gear and then 2 seconds latter engages the gear and it is the temp that may cause this although it would just be the program the car is in. I am surprised it only has .9 liter of oil in the gearbox....Oh and the hand book identifies the Manual box as heavier than the Auto or is that a miss print... Graeme. On 14/07/2014 at 11:55, au-yt said: Peter More great info, thank you again and this helps identify the functions of the various components. The owners hand book also has an overview of the functions which are also helpful but not as descriptive as I would have thought. A description of each mode would help. There appears to be 4 angles of the throttle that effect the ECU 25% 30% and 100%. kick down. It measure how quickly you move the throttle both down and up and how far but in some modes will kick down to the lowest gear the ECU sees appropriate for the rpm. I read this as when driving spiritedly on open roads at legal speeds it should kick down to 2nd gear… Fun things identified so far, the rev protection part of the Manual mode makes for a bit of fun. Select Manual mode. 1st gear selected floor throttle and hold 6800 into second 6800 into third and you are in 6 points territory... too easy. Place and location withheld. Back to more serious things the temp sensor on the gearbox is interesting in that it changes the shift points to cool the box, and this may be why in some cases the car appears to match the gear and then 2 seconds latter engages the gear and it is the temp that may cause this although it would just be the program the car is in. I am surprised it only has .9 liter of oil in the gearbox....Oh and the hand book identifies the Manual box as heavier than the Auto or is that a miss print... Graeme. Hi Graeme, a diagnostic test reveals that my car (91 Tip) is in limp mode because of a failed ‘trans’ temperature sensor’ and for the life of me I cannot locate this on the gearbox. I need this info so I can remove it and pass on the part# to my parts supplier. Any help would be much appreciated. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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