Getting my 1983 911 cab back on the road

[AdRock]

What have I gotten myself into?! 
I picked up my 1983 911 Cabriolet yesterday. 

Originally imported from Japan back in 2005 I believe. It was then sold on to the owners who I purchased it from. 
The lovely gentleman that I purchased it from had it for about 10 years and over that time spent quite a lot of time and money on it.  Mostly focused on converting it from LHD to RHD. Unfortunately he became sick and had to move the car on for someone else to be able to finish his hard work. 

In order to do the RHD Conversion, he got in contact with a VicRoads approved engineer who had experience with Porsche steering conversions. The engineer advised him what was required to meet the required approvals. So, most of the work has been completed. The steering has been swapped across, the dash has mostly been completed, as have the pedals amongst other things. The engineer's certificate still hasn't been ticked off... so, once I get it running, I'll have to do the final few jobs to meet the engineer requirements. 

The interior has pretty much been stripped out with all the door cards and rear inner panels needing replacing.  The carpet has been replaced - I think with a homemade set... it will do for now. 

I've heard the car running for about 10 seconds... enough to hear that that there wasn't any obvious knocking or scary sounds... here's hoping that when I eventually get it started, it stays that way. 

Once we got it home yesterday, we gave it a good vacuum and wiped down all of the interior as it was really, really dusty.  I felt much better once it was all cleaned out. 

The car was originally white, but sprayed Red in Japan.  I was told that the car had only completed 83,000km's in it's life (as per the speedo reading) but there's no matching documents to prove this is correct., Also I find it strange that someone would respray a car before it had done even 100,000kms. I personally dont think the speedo reading is correct - but who knows.

 

 

I actually love that this car comes from Japan. I visit Japan as much as I can, so for me, it's an awesome bit of history. I'd love to find out more about it's Japanese owners and where in Japan it lived before coming to Australia.  

 

Brand new seats installed by previous owner.  I don't love the colour - but they seem like very nice seats.  Shame they aren't just plain black. The owner wanted to go for a 90's red theme inside it seems. 

Including steering wheel and gear shifter cover. 

 

This is the nightmare I have in front of me.  I know nothing about car electrics. I can do engines and bodywork... but electrics I have no experience with. I'm wondering if it would be easier to start again with a brand new wiring loom.  I guess this is what happens when someone does a DIY steering conversion. 

 

Some more Japanese delivered Porsche goodness.

 

What do you do when your car is full of electrical gremlins? Add some more electrical components to complicate things! (Previous owner installed this). Don't know if it's hooked up yet. 

 

Please let me know if you see anything completely out of place in the engine bay

 

One of the dashboard bits that isn't working.  The Handbrake light works ok, but the seatbelt light does not... possibly not hooked up correctly... or maybe a blown bulb.  Any easy way to test the bulb with a multimeter?

 

 

Unfortunately the only place I have found rust so far in the car is inside this filler next to the petrol filler. Is this the wiper fluid filler? 
It was pretty rusty inside... I sanded it back as best i could, vacuumed out what I sanded to stop it dropping down the tube... put some rust converter on it for about 20 mins and sealed it with some penetrol for the time being... hopefully that slows down the rust. 

 

It came with this funky tool kit... not sure if it's the original... the tools do say they are made in West Germany though. 

 

I turned the ignition onto ACCESSORY and got a really loud buzzing from the engine bay... I couldn't quite pick where... is that normal??

Anyway... I'm going to have to think about how i'm going to proceed with all the wiring that is EVERYWHERE. No matter what I do, I'm going to have to get very good at reading wiring diagrams - or find a pile of cash to pay an auto elec to sort it out for me. 

 

[AdRock]

From what I can tell... this foot long rubber seal that sits behind the windows on the cabriolet has been compressed over the years and there's a decent sized gap between the seal and the window.  Just did some googling and every website is charging approx $250-$300 per side!! Geez at this rate, I'll be sealing any gaps up with some silicone!

 

Cheers

[ANF]

Congrats again for you new project! Looking forward to your progress

Unfortunately none of your pics are showing up this time?

[AdRock]

Oh really? Bugger! Must be a google photo thing. I'll see what I can do to fix it.

[Ozvino]

You can get leather seats dyed - going to black is pretty easy. Try this guy

http://www.leathercreations.com.au/

 

[KG]

7 hours ago, AdRock said:

Oh really? Bugger! Must be a google photo thing. I'll see what I can do to fix it.

Yep, I had this issue also, Google wont allow you to share your photo for over a specific view count. I've found that imgur.com is the best to post pics with.

Looking forward to your build...

[AdRock]

10 hours ago, ANF said:

Congrats again for you new project! Looking forward to your progress

Unfortunately none of your pics are showing up this time?

I have added the photos to a public album instead and updated the links... can you see the pics now?

[poli84]

Pictures are working! Gee you have a project ahead of you. Good luck mate!

[Troubleshooter]

Pictures went up, looked at the froot and wiring, ran and hid under my bed 

Going to your first words Rocky ""What have I gotten myself into?! "" Dont do the overwhelm! Provided the basics are correct as per rust, vin, running gear etc you'll sort it. I'd go the total new wiring loom route since that's the one thing you can't do yourself. Lots of help and resources on here thanks to the great knowledgeable gents and one step at a time it'll come together. Arm up with coffee, a fat wallet and flowers for the missus you'll be in that garage a lot

[Ozvino]

- Toolkit is standard/factory

- Crazy shit happened to 911's in the 80s and 90s. People converted then, painted them, added fibreglass, added whale tails,  you name it. Everyones wet dream was a guards red 911 Turbo so it seemed that half of the 911's were destroyed in the process of making that wet dream a reality - so its highly likely it was just repainted for fashion reasons

- Seats and wheel - you might want to think about if you really want to keep those; it will detract from the value of the car, you should be able to find a 911 wheel and seats for not stupid money and it will improve the car look 10 fold

- Seat belt light not working is probably tied to those pimped seats

- IMHO wiring in the frunk of an old 911 always looks like a rats nest - probably worth trying to get the original loom operational before delving into the depths of a new loom

[AdRock]

2 hours ago, Ozvino said:

- Toolkit is standard/factory

- Crazy shit happened to 911's in the 80s and 90s. People converted then, painted them, added fibreglass, added whale tails,  you name it. Everyones wet dream was a guards red 911 Turbo so it seemed that half of the 911's were destroyed in the process of making that wet dream a reality - so its highly likely it was just repainted for fashion reasons

- Seats and wheel - you might want to think about if you really want to keep those; it will detract from the value of the car, you should be able to find a 911 wheel and seats for not stupid money and it will improve the car look 10 fold

- Seat belt light not working is probably tied to those pimped seats

- IMHO wiring in the frunk of an old 911 always looks like a rats nest - probably worth trying to get the original loom operational before delving into the depths of a new loom

Yep and I'm lucky enough to be blessed with a whale tail spoiler haha.

Yeh, I'm not in love with the Steering wheel or the red shifter cover that's on there. The shifter cover can just be slid off and the original one is underneath... although I'll need to track down an original shifter knob.

The steering wheel is definitely not to my taste... but I guess the biggest concern is getting it all up and running and tuned up before worrying about the steering wheel. Maybe I can some how dye/paint it until I can get a decent old skool version.  I dont need some fancy Momo wheel.  

The seats I actually dont mind... I mean - the colour is ridiculous... but they are brand new and have 0km's on them. Seems a shame to get rid of them since they are so new and they're pretty comfy too. Someone posted me a link earlier to a place than can do a colour change - which could be good - depending on cost. 

Yeh... good point about the new loom... I'll see if I can work with what I've got there to save a few bucks initially... I'm sure it's all there - just a bit messy and requires some work to neaten up. 

Need to purchase a battery this week, the one that is in it is flat and doesn't hold charge. It currently has a Bosch B68 in it. I'm not sure if that's correct?
 

[Dalai]

3 minutes ago, AdRock said:

 I dont need some fancy Momo wheel.  

Be a fair bit cheaper than an original in good condition!

[poetry911]

My first 911 was as a 21 year old. I bought an interior and roof stripped out cab from the states.., 83 also. As soon as we got the engine started, in went the milk crate, and off we went  

You said your engine starts.., no stress. You have seats. Drive away

[Gsaps]

On 29/04/2018 at 10:54 PM, AdRock said:

I turned the ignition onto ACCESSORY and got a really loud buzzing from the engine bay... I couldn't quite pick where... is that normal??

 

I’m no expert but I know they make a horrible buzzing if the doors open an ignition is on, could be that 

[AdRock]

As my car lives about 30 mins from me - I only get to play with it on weekends and even then usually only for one day of the weekend.

So, I decided to get the car ready for some attempts at firing it up by giving it a mini service... my plan for Saturday was to drain the oil and adjust the valve clearances. Doing both of these jobs on my VW's would take me easily under an hour. I had no idea how long this oil had been in the Porsche so thought I'd drain it and put in some good clean stuff and hope that no chunky bits of engine came out with the oil.

So, on Friday I manged to get the correct valve cover gasket set from Porsche for a grand total of $75.  A little different to the $16 I spent on valve gaskets for my kombi!

I also ordered a whole bunch of stuff that I needed from supercheap auto like oil, a big drain pan and some other bits and pieces. It was ready and waiting for me Saturday morning to be picked up.  Much more convenient that wandering around the shop for an hour trying to find what I need.

I also picked up a new battery from Independent Battery Distributors in Laverton. Nice guys and he gave me $50 off the price of the battery... not sure why. A nice shiny new Bosch battery. Should be good for helping me find my electrical issues!!

 

So, first things first - I dropped the oil out of the oil tank. Nice. Easy done, although there was less than I was expecting. It seemed that most of the oil drained out of the sump itself. All up there was about 10 litres that came out. No nasty chunks of engine to be seen. There was some white sludgey stuff on the tank plug, which I believe it from condensation and the car not being driven in over 10 years.

 

Turned out that the guy who i bought the car from gave me the wrong replacement oil filters... a Saturday search of SCA, repco, bursons and autobarn all came up with nothing - it's a specialist filter that needs to be ordered in.  Doh! Looks like I wont be finishing this job this weekend. I ended up ordering a Mahle one online for $35 delivered. Same price as SCA wanted for their Ryco version.

Once all the oil was out I moved to removing the valve covers. I started on the right side top.  Geez - they're not in the most convenient location to get to! But I got the nuts off relatively easily.  The guy on the you tube video just slid his covers off once the nuts were off.  Ummm.... not happening for me. I tried everything to get them off, but no joy.  Turns out someone has used some red RTV sealant to help prevent leaks. Ugh! So, i thought i'd get underneath and try the exhaust valve cover.  Same again! Glued on tight! I even went and bought a heat gun to see if heating the sealant would help. But considering it's more than likely high temp sealant, it didn't make a difference.  I tried to pry them off, but I was very concerned about damaging the sealing edge of the head / cover. I was literally there for hours trying to get these covers off until I just gave up.  I thought I'd check online and it seems that most people have success with prying them off or whacking with a piece of wood/rubber mallet. I'll have another go next weekend. At least I will have the correct oil filter.

I also assessed the tyres on the car.  They are junk.  Full of cracks for sitting for 10 years.  I wouldn't even risk driving to the tyre shop on them. 
Looks like when I get new tyres, I'll just be putting the whole car on stands and taking the wheels directly to the shop for fitting.

I did also notice that when setting the engine to TDC on cylinder 1, that the dizzy wasn't lining up completely with the notch on the side of the dizzy.

I've read that's not completely unheard of - possibly because of the way the dizzy timing is set.  Hopefully that's all it is.

 

 

 

Stay tuned for more updates next week, when I learn some new swear words for getting those rocker covers off.... any tips would be appreciated!!

[AdRock]

Well, as some of you might have seen on Facebook, the joy and excitement of Porsche ownership have quickly faded for me. 

I finally got those rocker covers off, after almost 4 days of trying! They were locked down TIGHT! 

 

 

A few people suggested that I should drop the engine out to clean off those heads. But I wasn't having any of that. I was keen to clean it up, adjust the valves and get the car running ASAP! That all changed when i got that final lower valve cover off and then my guts sank.  A broken head stud. 

 

 

Bugger! So, I've pulled out my Bentley and stared following the steps to drop out the engine... I think i have about 3/4 of it done, except for disconnecting the oil hose and some under car transmission stuff and starter wires. 

Now to start researching and working out how I'm going to go about getting it all fixed. 

I'm thinking I'll take the heads to a machine shop and getting them and the valve covers checked to confirm they are flat. If they are warped, maybe it's why the PO was using so much silicone sealer. can't hurt to skim them.  The question is... do I get the valves done at the same time...   I'll do a leakdown test before dismantling which might assist me with that answer. 

 

Do I need a specific engine stand yoke for a 3.0 SC engine? Or can I just use my universal stand? 

I also have to decide which replacement studs i'm going to go with... from what I've read so far, the standard Porsche OEM steel studs should be a good replacement. 

[Coastr]

The head stud in hand is always a nasty gut punch.  Make a decision whether you’re just fixing that or going further.  The temptation will be strong.

For the wiring it’s complicated but not impossible.  Just trace wires out and label, and start testing and wrapping.  Finding non factory modifications and removing them is important -  but a l-r conversion is going to need a lot of changes.

[Peter M]

Ad,

My suggestion with the engine is to just check the valve clearances, clean off the red sealant, check the rocker cover for flatness, reassemble, add oil and filter and run it.  If it runs fine you are welcome to a huge sigh of relief! 

I'd put my initial efforts into getting the car road worthy and presentable.  Once you do this, the car will have some value and be easily saleable if you happen to lose interest.  The engine will run fine (and without further damage) long enough with one missing head stud for you then to figure out if you like it enough to invest more funds into it or not.

If you pull the engine now you have created one more huge challenge on top of the two you have already.  Also pulling the engine will mean you are up for somewhere between $5,000 and $20,000 depending on it's condition and how prone you are to "while I'm in there".

Good work and keep posting!

 

PS:  Write yourself an action plan of jobs so that you avoid having to rework things by doing them in the wrong order and also helps you have the parts at hand as you need them.  For parts have James at Autohaus on your speed dial and Design911 in your internet favourites.   Ebay will be handy too.

[P-Kay]

^ what he said. Save your dollar$ If the car was driving fine, then why bother. I know several people who have and are still running with one and greater than 1 broken studs.

It's half way out now, so make the valve adjustment and cleaning a bucket load easier and continue on the extraction. As far as the valve covers go - remove the silicone and just rub them on the concrete driveway/garage floor in a figure 8 until you see all surfaces clean. I suspect it will be very quick and once done you will have straight and flat covers that just require a gasket only.

[AdRock]

9 hours ago, Coastr said:

The head stud in hand is always a nasty gut punch.  Make a decision whether you’re just fixing that or going further.  The temptation will be strong.

For the wiring it’s complicated but not impossible.  Just trace wires out and label, and start testing and wrapping.  Finding non factory modifications and removing them is important -  but a l-r conversion is going to need a lot of changes.

Yep, winded me pretty good!

I think I'll just be content with replacing the studs, replacing some gaskets, fuel lines, cleaning up the engine bay/tinware, the soundproofing seems to be crumbling and falling off the top of the engine bay, so that should prob be replaced. I would be doing it all myself and I'm in no huge rush... getting it done by spring would be ideal.

I was actually looking forward to getting the wiring sorted - it was going to be my next job after getting it running and valve adjustments. doh!
I think most of the swap over for L/R conversion has been done, just a few bits and pieces that need checking/fixing.

3 hours ago, Peter M said:

Ad,

My suggestion with the engine is to just check the valve clearances, clean off the red sealant, check the rocker cover for flatness, reassemble, add oil and filter and run it.  If it runs fine you are welcome to a huge sigh of relief! 

I'd put my initial efforts into getting the car road worthy and presentable.  Once you do this, the car will have some value and be easily saleable if you happen to lose interest.  The engine will run fine (and without further damage) long enough with one missing head stud for you then to figure out if you like it enough to invest more funds into it or not.

If you pull the engine now you have created one more huge challenge on top of the two you have already.  Also pulling the engine will mean you are up for somewhere between $5,000 and $20,000 depending on it's condition and how prone you are to "while I'm in there".

Good work and keep posting!

 

PS:  Write yourself an action plan of jobs so that you avoid having to rework things by doing them in the wrong order and also helps you have the parts at hand as you need them.  For parts have James at Autohaus on your speed dial and Design911 in your internet favourites.   Ebay will be handy too.

Thanks Peter, that's actually a really good suggestion, but for me since I'm already waist deep in the engine bay getting dirty, I'm keen to just get it fixed and know that I have a reliable engine... well reliable engine studs anyway.   When I went to inspect the car initially, the car ran, but maybe for about 15 seconds only. In that time it was blowing quite a bit of smoke... first time I've ever seen a car blow an actual smoke ring! Most people would have walked away... but I was desperate for a Porsche... and personally I'd rather a car blowing some smoke than having rust all through the body (of which I'm yet to find any!)

So, because of the smoke, I will do a leakdown test and see if I can work out if there's a ring / valve issue that could do with fixing whilst it's out - possibly the cause of the smoke.  The seller who was a very genuine bloke told me he filled the oil when the car was off and after that, it started smoking... so it's likely excess oil is the only reason for the smoke... but now is as good a time as any to check / address it if it's not - I think?

I come from a VW background (I have a kombi and a type 3 squareback) and have dropped and installed engines many times, so that' side of things isn't really a big deal for me. I did a top end rebuild on the Type 3 a few years ago, new heads, new P's and C's, oil pump, etc and I got out of that for under $1200! The 1641 engine now runs brilliantly!

I'm really keen to keep the spending to a minimum on the Porsche engine... as above - ideally just some replacement studs, gaskets and other stuff that is easier to do when the engine is out and usually not so accessible. 

Great idea about writing up a plan of attack.  Usually, i'm super unorganised, so it would be good for me to do something like that.

3 hours ago, P-Kay said:

^ what he said. Save your dollar$ If the car was driving fine, then why bother. I know several people who have and are still running with one and greater than 1 broken studs.

It's half way out now, so make the valve adjustment and cleaning a bucket load easier and continue on the extraction. As far as the valve covers go - remove the silicone and just rub them on the concrete driveway/garage floor in a figure 8 until you see all surfaces clean. I suspect it will be very quick and once done you will have straight and flat covers that just require a gasket only.

Unfortunately, i dont know if the car was driving fine... there was lots of smoke, so I figure now is the perfect time to investigate... especially since the car is off the road for various other reasons anyway.... just means the project will take a little bit longer.
I did read some articles about people running with one missing head stud... but i did also read that it should probably be avoided if it's a head stud that's at either end of the head and this one was at #1 i believe (front left).

Yeh, I've got a few spare pieces of glass to check for flatness of the valve covers with some sandpaper, will be doing that for sure. 

Unfortunately I gouged one of the heads a little when trying to open up those damn valve covers. Not the end of the world and prob wont leak much, if at all.

 

Still wondering what you guys do for an engine stand? Do you have to use a Porsche yoke or is a Universal stand ok? The price is pretty ridiculous when you include shipping - even if you just get an adapter!

 

[Cheshire Cat]

I've recently ordered a yoke from samba.com. cheaper than anywhere but the shipping is a killing. But still it's the cheapest one. 

[P-Kay]

Specific yoke only needed if you're going to split the case. If you plan on only top-end, then I see no reason why the standard one will not do.

Regarding smoke.....mine is new(rebuilt) and does that after sitting for a while, so don't make your decision of a rebuild based on that  Reading your rational though, I get it - the piece of mind is a good thing  

[ANF]

Peace of mind is great, but why does it have to cost so much...…. 

[P-Kay]

Yea freaken tell me about it!!!!!!

Don't get me started, otherwise I will have to go to the vent section!!!

[AdRock]

 

30 minutes ago, ANF said:

Peace of mind is great, but why does it have to cost so much...…. 

Funny you mention cost... I was browsing sites yesterday for replacement studs and I came across the ARP site. The way their product search is set up allowed me to search for engine size rather than specific model of car the parts were for. So I selected 3.0 and up came a stud kit that was about $250!! woohoo!! bargain! Especially since ARP studs seem to be highly recommended!   A little while later, realised that usually if it seems too good to be true, then it usually is. So, I went back and realised that the studs i found were for a 944.  The lower down there was an option for 911. I picked that and found a specific 911 kit. Wouldn't you know it.... 911 tax has been added and they are about $600 USD. Once you convert that to AUD and include postage, I would probably be up for closer to $1000 for studs!!!

Just for a laugh, I looked up how much studs would cost on my Kombi if I wanted to replace them all.  A big fat $100. :S

 

43 minutes ago, P-Kay said:

Specific yoke only needed if you're going to split the case. If you plan on only top-end, then I see no reason why the standard one will not do.

Regarding smoke.....mine is new(rebuilt) and does that after sitting for a while, so don't make your decision of a rebuild based on that  Reading your rational though, I get it - the piece of mind is a good thing  

That's fantastic news, thanks P-Kay! I definitely dont plan on case splitting at this stage! Means I have more money for an engine crane... or to pay friends beer to get it lifted onto the stand. :P

I'll definitely do a leakdown test and then a visual inspection.  There's a specialist head reco place literally around the corner from where the car is stored, so it probably wouldn't hurt for me to take them in and just get their opinion if anything 'needs' doing.   But I very much plan to touch as little as possible and get it all back together ASAP. Especially since to work on the engine, the car would need to sit outside, but under a car cover. Maybe I'll invest in one of those little temp car ports too. Cheap on ebay I believe.