BAFE Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Greetings all, My battery looks to have died, RACV test shows 12.3V but "cold amps" are 260 and should be 530 ? Car is an '07 Boxster with only 28,000 K's (So not historically driven much - but that's changed since i bought it) Told by P dealer a replacement is $300 (seems cheap as the Benz battery was $700+) RACV wanted $207 is the Original worth 50% more or am I just being a tight arse... what other options do i have? It just looks like a normal battery to me No reference to Nasa or anything else that looks particularly amazing…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunky Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 I'd lash on the original as there are batteries and there are batteries and like all things Porsche, the OEM stuff really does last a lot longer than aftermarket *equivalents*. Edit: If an extra $100 scares you, then you may have bought the wrong vehicle... just sayin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustJames Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Are Porsche electrons any different to electrons out of any other battery? If the car is sitting for long periods of time I'd put the extra money into a trickle charger. (And for a modern car which has an immobiliser, clever stereo and who knows what else slowly sipping away at the battery "long periods of time" means anything over 2 weeks.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAFE Posted 3December, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Are Porsche electrons any different to electrons out of any other battery? If the car is sitting for long periods of time I'd put the extra money into a trickle charger. (And for a modern car which has an immobiliser, clever stereo and who knows what else slowly sipping away at the battery "long periods of time" means anything over 2 weeks.) Its not really sitting for too long, it gets driven a few times a week. Previous owner did 22,500K's in 6 years I've done 6,000K's in 3 months but i hear you, might buy the "real battery" and be done with it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Just James's advice is good Ian. I would save the 100 bucks as long as its the same spec and spend that money on a Ctek Charger that can just be plugged in when the car is not in use. I have had one for quite a number of years now and its great given my very irregular use of the car. c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter M Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Bafe,I'm with JJ, buy the $207 battery and spend the savings on something other than a dealer's mark up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NiX Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Went for this one a few months back, called & picked up from Ashburton + a Ctek charger as well for the winter months. http://www.everybattery.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=Varta-F17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAFE Posted 3December, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 that's the brand that the dealer was going to install as a "Porsche replacement" beauty i'll follow that one up. thanks bloke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAFE Posted 3December, 2013 Author Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Went for this one a few months back, called & picked up from Ashburton + a Ctek charger as well for the winter months.http://www.everybattery.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=Varta-F17 Interesting there's not a Varta battery for the 987 they are recommending a Century for $160... sounds good to me…. thanks for the tip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunky Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Are Porsche electrons any different to electrons out of any other battery? If the car is sitting for long periods of time I'd put the extra money into a trickle charger. (And for a modern car which has an immobiliser, clever stereo and who knows what else slowly sipping away at the battery "long periods of time" means anything over 2 weeks.) Um OK so all batteries produce electrons so therefore all batteries are the same James ? Now I know your expertise is parts and not 12volt electronics but I am still surprised by this response. I guess you suggest no one ever use Porsche OEM parts when a cheaper non genuine part is available(no matter the quality difference) because all Porsches use the same petrol as all other cars ? All tyres are rubber so just get some retreads James ? Having spent the best part of 30 years working in the automotive 12 volt DC field, I can tell you some makers care about their customers and don't order parts by cheapest tender. Porsche is one , Honda was another. If having a car that just starts (when used regularly) is important then go OEM but if you think a cheap battery saves you money in the long run, then ignore my advice, as after all an electron is just an electron, and all electrolytes are the same and the purity of lead used in all batteries is the same...oh hang on no there not. Of all the ppl to suggest this you would have been last one I would have guessed but maybe that is my fault, as it was based on assumptions I guess. Anyway I have access to some of the best battery technology available and I might not go OEM when my battery dies(I still might as they are cheaper than I thought) but if I do I will spend more on it again and know exactly why I am doing so. I also know all batteries are not created equal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 My 987 has a non-Porsche battery in it and it's fine if that helps any Ian! Does anyone know who makes Porsches batteries? I'm sure they don't manufacture them in house do they????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunky Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Porsche do not make their own batteries, tyres, brake pads, seats, etc but they do use the equipment they do for a reason and their is also a reason they rate so highly in customer satisfation(I think they were #1 in US) and that because not only do their cars posses all the quality's we all love like superb handling, exceptional performance but also they are an incredibly reliable vehicle for such high performance. Sure many of you may think a battery is not an important part, and just stores a few electrons but it is what gets your car going everyday and if it is not in good shape it can not only give you trouble starting but also performance may suffer. Sure the OEM maybe $100 more but I would put money on it being less costly from a total cost of ownership accounting POV. Sure your cheaper alternative will be fine when new and may last a few years but I'm sure many long term owners here can attest to the longevity they have had out of factory batteries and if lasts a lot more winters and doesn't leave you stranded when you need to get to work, how much is that worth ? Anyway it's your money and a cheap battery will be fine, as Amanda puts it, but my point is for how long ? If anyone want's to talk battery technology and why some batteries cost a lot more, I am happy to share my knowledge on the subject but if everyone is just thinking about the purchase price, then I have a fair idea why the ppl who make printers are laughing all the way to the bank just because of that same thought process peace Cyberpunky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 I said my car has a non-Porsche battery in it and it is fine. I never said anything about 'cheap' those are your words. Everyone has opinions Bruce, you are being a bit heavy handed with yours in this thread... my opinion of course! Anyway it's your money and a cheap battery will be fine, as Amanda puts it, but my point is for how long ? peace Cyberpunky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 try these Bond batteries they are an excellent and long lasting battery with probably the best warrantee on the market! http://www.yellowpages.com.au/vic/bayswater/bond-batteries-12940985-listing.html they also have the correct size battery for the up to 1973 911's! We have been using them for many years now and the best life I have seen is 9 years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Man Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 The previous owner of my car saw it fitting to put in a non genuine battery. Supercharge brand and I assume would have at least similar specs to what was in there originally. Car only gets driven once a week or so, but she fires up and does what she needs to.The last thing I am is "cheap", however I find it difficult to justify the ridiculous prices from PCM for a battery which can be purchased from other sources.Seems that Porsche may want $300 for a Varta battery that could be shopped elsewhere for the same brand and model at a more competitive price.If the 993 battery gave up, would I buy a battery from Porsche? Don't think so!Does that make me cheap to save $100? Not in my opinion.Does my wanting to save $100 mean I've "probably bought the wrong vehicle"? No. It just means I have $100 to spend elsewhere.We are all entitled to our opinions and as an open forum of enthusiasts we seek advice from those that may know a little better.The last thing that anyone wants is to be shot down in flames................Just saying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunky Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Actually Amanda I never said your battery was cheap, I said cheap batteries are fine I would expect any battery to be fine in the short term. How long have you had yours? Can you see how fine is kinda meaningless in a discussion about value of spending more ($100) on genuine vs Aftermarket when to quantify any value time needs to be factored in ? Sorry if you think I'm heavy handed but 12 volts has been my livelihood for most of my life and to have someone barely out of their apprenticeship make a smart ass remark about special Porsche electrons when they should know better if they represent a trusted industry company IMO. It really is like saying all tyres are rubber and hold air or worse a car just gets you from a to b My advice was given freely and so that is how much it's worth but I don't expect it to be mocked What gets me more is guy's who'll spend 10k on engine mods agree with trying to cheap out on a battery when we are talking $100... seriously??? isn't this a Porsche forum. If it was mighty cheap car mods it might make sense. Has anyone here had a genuine battery for more than 5 minutes and care to weigh in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunky Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Whoa there. cyber, who brought me into this little s###fight? Just sitting on the sidelines watching with interest at this stage. However....haven't started mine for over 5 or 6 weeks, So I'm glad Bafe threw himself on the wire before I probably would've asked the same question. My battery has been in my box since I got the car back in 2008 and has been great so far. Will check today and see what sort it is. Personally if I can get 4 or more years out of a battery I am happy with that. If/ when I need one be happy for an aftermarket one. Anyways....each to their own, It's not a performance mod, so no big deal to me, if you can save a few bucks and still get what you expect so be it. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 I`m certainly no battery expert, but having purchased at least 20 + of the things I have found that the ones that the RACV bring to you or service station batterys have lasted about three to four years on average,be it for daily drivers or weekenders with trickle chargers attatched,but the original batterys have have lasted chrysler 8 years still going, audi replaced after 9 years.I put a porsche battery in my 993 in 2006 replacing a non genuine which was buggered when I got the car and it is still going strong .I am not saying all after market batterys are crap but comparatively and from my limited experience an extra 100 bucks seems pretty light Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Man Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 Actually Amanda I never said your battery was cheap, I said cheap batteries are fine I would expect any battery to be fine in the short term. How long have you had yours? Can you see how fine is kinda meaningless in a discussion about value of spending more ($100) on genuine vs Aftermarket when to quantify any value time needs to be factored in ? Sorry if you think I'm heavy handed but 12 volts has been my livelihood for most of my life and to have someone barely out of their apprenticeship make a smart ass remark about special Porsche electrons when they should know better if they represent a trusted industry company IMO. It really is like saying all tyres are rubber and hold air or worse a car just gets you from a to b My advice was given freely and so that is how much it's worth but I don't expect it to be mocked What gets me more is guy's who'll spend 10k on engine mods agree with trying to cheap out on a battery when we are talking $100... seriously??? isn't this a Porsche forum. If it was mighty cheap car mods it might make sense. Has anyone here had a genuine battery for more than 5 minutes and care to weigh in? Bruce, I'm a little confused? I don't believe I have read anything in these posts that mocked your advice. What I have read are a range of different opinions. Questions are raised on this forum constantly and there are a number of "experts" in their field who respond with advice and suggestions. That advice is not always agreed on as even some of us "non-experts" are guilty of having only a little knowledge on a subject, which we all know can be a dangerous thing. There is no doubt that with your history in high level car audio you are potentially one of the most qualified here to talk about the loads that batteries are put under and the failures of "cheap" products. Not a problem. The "heavy handed" comment from Amanda was directed not at your knowledge, passion or opinion, but more-so at the way you delivered the comments containing personal criticism. We don't always have to agree, but we do need to "play nice"!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-banger Posted 3December, 2013 Report Share Posted 3December, 2013 It difficult to make judgement based on anecdotal evidence alone as battery use and storage conditions vary so much from car to car. Cyber do you have any science re OEM Vs other? I think I could fairly say that most people want "value" for their hard earned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted 4December, 2013 Report Share Posted 4December, 2013 it would be interesting to know what battery manufacturer Porsche uses ('cause I'd assume you could just buy the non-branded equivalent for less) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunky Posted 4December, 2013 Report Share Posted 4December, 2013 Sorry Niko nd Amanda. I cant tell the brand of mine without removing which is not a simple task in my car but it is OEM. I have put my OEM battery through hell and after 3 years of abuse it's still going strong. I have a random no start issue with my speed and ref sensors that I think is on the loom side. I wont know for sure tilll I replace the sensors but for a long time I used to roll start car off starter motor. I have since found out a simple jiggle will get car going everytime but my battery copped it for a couple of years, often getting flattened by the process of trying to get my car going, and a lesser battery would be dead by now. In car audio most standard batteries are lucky to last 3 years tops as the demands we place on them are much higher than normal but even under ideal conditions 5 to 6 years is best case. A better battery is made differently as you would expect. An Optima for example uses AGM technology. AGM is absorbed glass matt, and what happens is rather than having electrolyte slopping around like a std battery, it uses glass matt(like fibreglass) to hold the electrolyte in. The surface tension holds the fluid in the matt. The advantage of this is that they seal the battery and it never needs to be topped up. It also means battery can be mounted upside down or any other position. They also use what they call spiral cell technology. What they do is mount the plates in a dense spiral method which prevents plates from buckling. A common cause of failure in std batteries. This is also a big advantage in rough conditions like 4wd or racing which put more vibration through the battery than pottering down to the shops. They also refine the lead to a much higher purity than in a std battery which helps with having maximum power density(higher CCA) and longevity as it is impurities that can shorten battery life. I have personally had one of these batteries last over 10 years no probs and I think t is still in use now which would be going on 12 years ish of high abuse conditions. It was common in the motor industry for ppl to take the honda batteries out of trade ins for their personel cars and replace them with a std battery for the new owner. Back then honda used Yaseau(am not sure of spelling) batteries and they lasted much longer than std batteries. They were also more expensive. As Steve has noted his OEM battery has lasted 7 years so far and IMO will keep going a lot longer. From an accountants total cost of ownership POV that means he is already better off financially than spending $100 less as a std battery would have been replaced by now IMO. Cheap batteries usually are a false economy, like printers, as although purchase price is lower, the fact they need replacing much sooner ends up costing you more, and in our case will lead to a hassle, usually one winters day, when the car just wont start. A battery might not be considered a perormance mod but it can be a reliability mod and for a lot of us that is a big plus. Many ppl here including myself dont baulk spending big bucks just servicing our cars and often trick them up with expensive mods like exhausts etc so for me $100 on a more reliable battery is a no brainer, as it is something that over the long haul will work out cheaper IMO. Anyway as I have said, it is your $100 so spend it or don't, thats up to you but IMO when your car just starts 7, 8 or more years winters later and you haven't had an issue, you will have long forgotten that $100. As to the mocking comment of do Porsche;s have special Porsche electrons, the answer is no but OEM batteries do have better quality manufacturing methods that would include the mounting of the plates to minimise buckling of plates(buckled plates results in a dead cell and a 10Volt battery), would use purer lead in plates(higher power density/ greater longevity) and better quality electrolyte, This costs more to make and hence higher price. Sure maybe some P car tax in there too but worth paying in this case IMO For me it is like tyres, in that I may not buy the most expensive but I will buy quality. I wouldn't even consider cheapest option as the tyres protect my car by keeping it on the road. I won't take my car to just anyone to work on, I pay someone who knows my car backwards even though the local guy may charge less /hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevepGT3 Posted 4December, 2013 Report Share Posted 4December, 2013 recently I put lithium Ion battery's in the bikes, as the last one in one of the bikes only saw one outing, good quality OEM Yuasa , Two AHEM + years on the trickle charger, still full of acid but two dead cells. It will be interesting to see how the L/I`s hold up to non use Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzieman Posted 4December, 2013 Report Share Posted 4December, 2013 My approach is to discard the lowest quote , discard the highest quote , read "Choice" and watch this again http://youtu.be/FAgZlwSGYE8 If you ain't got a crank handle, you need a quality battery i.e. the vast majority of peeps in modern cars. Even with a crank handle , the old saying "Lucas - home before dark" may apply to those who do not maintain electrics carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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