tazzieman Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 ...and the high price of old Fords and Holdens (and many other non German brands) largely reflects sentimentality , rather than build quality! (btw I was brought home in a Morris Traveller ; they are worth a mint now!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarreraG50 Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 "As for v8 super cars, it's a silhouette series now with plastic body panels on a space frame chassis. Does anyone think that this is a coincidence, that the new formula was introduced before the local assemblers went kaput? Whatever replaces the commodore and falcon will have their silhouettes applied to a v8 chassis, and everyone will pretend that nothing has really changed." I see one of the "big 2" manufacturer teams have asked for a relaxation in the rules, to run a coupe body. Mustang me thinks....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OZ930 Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I spoke to guy at Brisbane airport before the last election who said that Holden would close if Abbott won! Dont know who he was but....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I spoke to guy at Brisbane airport before the last election who said that Holden would close if Abbott won! Dont know who he was but....... Holden was done for no matter who won. Anyone who thought you could build unique cars for a tiny market in a state with the worlds most expensive assembly labour and the worlds most expensive electricity was kidding themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB911 Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Yeah, sadly you're right its just too expensive in Australia to have a car industry. But haven't we done it bloody well!!! The Ford XR6 turbo typhoon, the Holden Monaro Coupe 4 all wheel drive 5.7 litre, we've built some fantastic cars. Holden and Ford, I for one will miss you and your bloody great beasts. R.I.P. 2017 G50, Ford have already said they will race the Mustang in the V8's and I guess Holden will run the Camaro as the Commodore is sadly destined to die (He says with a tear in his eye). I love Porsches, but I have had some amazing times in v8 powered Holden's. Brocky, I know you are turning in your grave as we speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vas Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 With Abbott we also lost any environmental credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I obviously didn't think out my Government statement prior to making it! Anyhow, it's still a shame but if the people aren't buying your product... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Gees, hope we aren't getting political here...... C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OZ930 Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 No, I don't think its getting political, its just a general awakening !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withers Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Gees, hope we aren't getting political here...... C I think it's all good Chris. I'm the one that added the G word to this thread. So my fault and for that I apologise. In hindsight, I realise I made what I now know was a uninformed statement! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Man Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Gees, hope we aren't getting political here...... CThree sides of politics here at work. One that wants to talk about the impact of government on cars, one that wants to talk about the impact of government on everything else and the most important political argument.........................FORD vs HOLDEN!!!!!!!!!Once these great Aussie icons are gone will we simply adopt the global (read American) replacements and continue to swear allegiance to a brand, even though that brand is no longer manufactured in this country? I hear that TOYOTA may stay. This is the last hope. Can't wait to see a Camry with a big banger V8 race at Bathurst!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Gees, hope we aren't getting political here...... C Should have put (joke). Don't take my comment seriously.... I do have some close friends directly affected and really feel for them. C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OZ930 Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Three sides of politics here at work. One that wants to talk about the impact of government on cars, one that wants to talk about the impact of government on everything else and the most important political argument.........................FORD vs HOLDEN!!!!!!!!! Once these great Aussie icons are gone will we simply adopt the global (read American) replacements and continue to swear allegiance to a brand, even though that brand is no longer manufactured in this country? I hear that TOYOTA may stay. This is the last hope. Can't wait to see a Camry with a big banger V8 race at Bathurst!!!! Can see it now, a Prius V8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris-p Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Or Yaris R8 Clubsport.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 Yeah, sadly you're right its just too expensive in Australia to have a car industry. But haven't we done it bloody well!!! The Ford XR6 turbo typhoon, the Holden Monaro Coupe 4 all wheel drive 5.7 litre, we've built some fantastic cars. Holden and Ford, I for one will miss you and your bloody great beasts. R.I.P. 2017 G50, Ford have already said they will race the Mustang in the V8's and I guess Holden will run the Camaro as the Commodore is sadly destined to die (He says with a tear in his eye). I love Porsches, but I have had some amazing times in v8 powered Holden's. Brocky, I know you are turning in your grave as we speak. Australia punched above its weight for performance cars. In the end the basic American muscle car concept was turned into the v8 sedan that could also go round corners. So much so that Australia was the only place left that knew how to build low cost muscle cars when the Americans finally decided to have another look at it. Hopefully Holden retains its engineering experience and continues to contribute to worldwide platform development. The Camaro and Ctsv both owe their lives to the commodore platform. No doubt the new mustang is headed our way with RHD production definite, not sure what they will do with the Camaro -calling it anything else but a Chevy Camaro would be weird. I suppose they could re-use the Monaro name and everyone could go out and buy chev badges on the net when they get home. Its a damn shame that this country couldn't keep building cars and making an export market, but the situation was ridiculous in terms of the cost of doing business in Australia. Somewhere along the lines "fair go" has morphed into "nobody ever has a bad day", and the spirit of independence and "have a go ya mug" are fast becoming "fill out these forms and wear a safety vest" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I feel sorry for the employees of Holden and also the associated businesses that will be affected.......at least they have a few years notice...something I wish I had been given when made redundant 12 months ago !! As a country I fear, we have no NEW industry or technology capability, which unfortunately means that people like myself now have to look off-shore to find an opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TINGY Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 It is a damn shame that this could be the beginning of the end for manufacturing in this country. I have been working in manufacturing since 1981 and this is the slowest I have ever seen it. The company I work for has stopped manufacturing 4 times this year for extended periods of 1-3 weeks at a time and will close for 3 weeks at Christmas for the first time in it's 95 year history. I truly feel for the workers at Holden because I was made redundant in '99 and it's not a good feeling when you have kids to feed and a mortgage to pay, rent etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveT Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I guess that means there will be a big stockpile of workers lined up to take over mining jobs. The wages for those jobs will then drop to more an average wage, it will become a normal thing to FIFO to a mining job for $60k a year and rarely see the wife and kids in your 3 weeks on 1 week off roster. Poor workers take it up the **** once more. I am lucky to be nearer the end of my working life than the start AND have a good paying job close to home. AND drive a Porsche! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OZ930 Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 It is a damn shame that this could be the beginning of the end for manufacturing in this country. I have been working in manufacturing since 1981 and this is the slowest I have ever seen it. The company I work for has stopped manufacturing 4 times this year for extended periods of 1-3 weeks at a time and will close for 3 weeks at Christmas for the first time in it's 95 year history. I truly feel for the workers at Holden because I was made redundant in '99 and it's not a good feeling when you have kids to feed and a mortgage to pay, rent etc. The beginning of the end for manufacturing happened in the early 70s, now its dumbing down society so that "we" don't realise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I have a mate's son who works for the Special Vehicles Division here in Melbourne, which apparently is run by Walkinshaw. They are selling heaps and they are very expensive cars (for Holdens that is, not being derogative there) Plenty of orders still coming in, so he thinks they are safe for the future at this stage. Although they have nothing to do with Holden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TINGY Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 What I don't get is our country is so clever, and some of the products we have invented or developed end up going offshore, why? Ok to some degree our wages might be a little bit higher than some other countries but only in certain sectors, and the dollar is absolutely killing manufacturing at the moment. Maybe we need to curb some of the wage rises that we get but it's so damn hard when utilities are rising faster than our wages and people are struggling to make ends meet day to day, I feel sorry for the young families at the moment bringing up kids and both parents battling to juggle their jobs and homelife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAFE Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 I have a mate's son who works for the Special Vehicles Division here in Melbourne, which apparently is run by Walkinshaw. They are selling heaps and they are very expensive cars (for Holdens that is, not being derogative there) Plenty of orders still coming in, so he thinks they are safe for the future at this stage. Although they have nothing to do with Holden. He's going to be in trouble when they run out of commodores to modify I won't miss Holden, I had a few and really don't like them at all but i do feel for the families effected. That's what really matters in all this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastr Posted 12December, 2013 Report Share Posted 12December, 2013 What I don't get is our country is so clever, and some of the products we have invented or developed end up going offshore, why? Ok to some degree our wages might be a little bit higher than some other countries but only in certain sectors, and the dollar is absolutely killing manufacturing at the moment. Maybe we need to curb some of the wage rises that we get but it's so damn hard when utilities are rising faster than our wages and people are struggling to make ends meet day to day, I feel sorry for the young families at the moment bringing up kids and both parents battling to juggle their jobs and homelife. You have uncovered the truth. High costs kill any business. A business lives on the difference between it's inputs and outputs. When the former overtakes the latter you're done. In Australia, we have the 3rd highest minimum sage in the world. South Australia where the Holden plant has the highest electricity prices in the developed world. Australia also has a highly regulated labour market, both 'hard' in terms of what is legal and what is not, but also 'soft' in terms of needing a credential for many things, and oh&s madness. The price of wholesale electricity for business like Holden has increased 40% in the last 6 years, and shows no signs of stopping. Any manufactured good is largely congealed energy of the electric and human type. Keep increasing the price of those two things and the result will be crystal clear. That's why Detroit pulled the pin no matter what the various governemtns threw at them. Australia has advantages in a stable legal system and currency, good ports (they could always be mproved) and a high level of education and literacy among the workforce. Australia also has great advantage in raw materials and has abundant cheap energy, but we have thrown away this advantage for no particular reason whatsoever. Great strides were made during the 1980s to open up the economy froma stagnant one low on innovations and full of state enterprise, but many of these gains are now resented because of the difficult changes they bring. The problem is unnecessary regulations and unnecessary taxes. If anyone here is employed in the construction industry I'm sure they can share the massive amounts of paperwork necessary to build anything, anywhere. This all costs money, and time, which is just money again. Put the cost of the building up, you increase the cost of occupancy. Cst of occupancy goes up, price of things sold in that building goes up. The last ten years has seen an ever-spiraling increase of the costs of inputs. Holden is not the first and will not be the last to succumb to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redmonster Posted 13December, 2013 Report Share Posted 13December, 2013 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2013/12/gm-looking-to-shutter-holden-re-brand-as-chevrolet-after-2017/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hugh Posted 13December, 2013 Report Share Posted 13December, 2013 ^^^ was that meant to be a serious article? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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