Feedback Wanted - Porsche Sport Driving School

[Ozvino]

Looking for feedback from anyone who has attended sessions at the Porsche Sport Driving School; Precision, precision Plus, performance etc. 

Did you see value, how was the instruction, general comments etc. 

They have events in November BYO car, my preference is the Queensland Sessions where you thrash Porsche's cars.

Thx

Dave

[symsy]

RS's in Qld, performace or masters I think they call it , with the basically telemetry feedback and coaching, through my braking points, trail braking etc, normal briefing in the morn, good day, good food not that you will wannna eat …no real interruptions, allowed  to do as you wish..just listen to your spotter on the radio and you show them respect they give it you back .

My brain faded before I could punch out any more laps .. well I could have done more laps but I was just declining in style.  I reckon I did 40-45 laps in a car .

Also driven probably 15 laps .. 5 Macan , 5 with Dean Canto and later in the day another 5 by Tomas Mezera to refine my lines, Craig Baird was also there ..just pot luck who you get your instruction from but all very approachable.

They ran tag team  with 3 of us in a group in my car, by the time you drive, get your gear/helmets/hans off  for debrief, the next dude is out on the track , probably 5 mins waiting ..maybe 10 and you could be back in a car or talking with the instructors.. yes standing time but didnt feel like a big issue.

For me in all honestly right now , Im not sure I need to go any faster e.g Cup cars, the guy I went with didnt even bother to do his last session , had his fill and was exhausted.

I will go do Camp 4 Ice if you wanna co-pilot  and there are any places left in Iceland.

 

[Ozvino]

Thanks @symsy, sounds good, appreciate the detailed feedback.

I am interested in a couple of O/S drives (German Black Forrest Drive, The Ice Drive and the 3 day RS course in the US) and they look for a couple of pre-cursor courses, plus its probably good to get a refresher on the basics.....

Edited 16August, 2017 by Ozvino

[KGB]

Application form.

Current vehicle;____________________

I dare you...

[Ozvino]

Application form.

Current vehicle; SAAB

I dare you...

Sounds like a challenge

[dan_189]

I got an email about the Melbourne event yesterday but got nervous when I read;

8. Vehicle third party property insurance and/or comprehensive insurance is the sole responsibility of the participant. I agree that my personal insurance arrangements are ultimately my responsibility and I will arrange any insurance at my expense.

Guess that's with any track day, i'd prefer to attend an event when you can use their cars and hopefully be fully insured

Edited 16August, 2017 by dan_189

[Port 911]

I did it at Mt Cotton in QLD a few yes back and it was great, I would do it again in a heartbeat. 

I did learn lots that you can put into practice, a few of the guy's I do drives with from time to time that do race, stop me and said you have had some training from the last time we went out.

I was setting the car up correctly before corners, getting through the corners faster then vanishing into the distance out of corners, it was great to apply the skills back in your own car.  

Did manage to scare to crape out of myself at times, it was a hoot. We were there just after the Macan came out a got a hot lap with Fabian Coulthard in the driver's seat, wow, man that is one complete vehicle. 

Yes do it if you can.

Edited 17August, 2017 by Port 911

[GC9911]

I've done Level 1,2 & 3 at Eastern Creek & Brisbane raceway. Highly recommended. Did some laps with Thomas Maz & Fabian C but spent most time with a guy named Ian Dyke, not sure if he still instructs but he's very, very good, he also did the targa tas lead car fast group. If he's there sign on!

My experience is I really benefited from instructors who understood the handling characteristics that are peculiar to Porsches, they were quickly able to pinpoint things that I needed to change to improve my Porsche driving.

What it will teach you is having the fastest car may not make you the fastest driver. 

Edited 16August, 2017 by GC9911

[Jason E]

I'd be really keen to do a driving instruction day.  I did some driving instruction in my job but it is all automatic vehicles so very different styles of driving.

[Oldmxnut]

Im booked in for masters and GT3 cup next month with Porsche at Willowbank in Qld. (long story, but I actually did the earthworks for this place in late 90s  ) .   Anyways I have done the Audi version (including LMS R8) a few years back and I hear they are very similar.  If you track your car, then make contact and probably jump to the higher levels.  If a social driver, then I think is a great way to do each one and pick up the odd skill and drive a range of cars in each level.   

I will say, going from a Audi R8 to a LMS car was like chalk and cheese though.  So going to assume its the same for GT3 to a cup car.   If you like cars, follow the racing from time to time but have never track raced, this is a must for your bucket list.  Put this in perspective, the V8 Supercar Lap record at Phillip Is is 1:32/33..  I personally did a 1:39 in a LMS car first day and I am no race car driver. The road car R8 the previous day, 1:50/55 ish..  The GT cars are in a realm of their own.    Did a video if your interested. https://vimeo.com/137369073  apologies for the video edit and music.  Loose's some of that V10 Music..    . Did an overview video as well which shows a bit of the instruction etc.. https://vimeo.com/138078780

One thing that you get to experience is 1.5G corning...  I think the 991 / 911 breaks traction in a corner at 1G... ?  Someone will know more on this Im sure.  But that was an eye opener for me how sticky these GT cup cars were.    Top speed was a little slower down the straight then the road car (big wing and are etc).  

The tele data later was really good.  Just goes to show how finely tuned these guys are that race.  Seeing the fractions of time, where you just lifted the throttle a faction early, pulled a gear to late or early.  Amazing how they do it lap after lap within 10th of a second a time. 

My point being, for an average guy being able to have the opportunity to drive a fully prepared race car for a day and experience driving a vehicle yourself at 90% of real race pace.. is worth every cent. Admittedly expensive but its value for money as a once off... 

Watching these again, I might book in for two goes..  . 

 

 

Edited 17August, 2017 by Oldmxnut

[firstone]

$?

[YellowDieselGolf]

For those (like me) on a budget, VW is doing driver training at Phillip island - next week.  Tickets are still available for some sessions.  $400 - $100 discount for VW owners if you contact them on facebook for a discount code.

The previous years format is practice ABS stops, slalom, skid pan, cornering, emergency lane change (and maybe others) and then two sessions of two laps.  Total duration is about 4 hours.  I've driven the GTI, GTI performance, Golf R, Scirocco R.  They've had the GTD and polo's there before too.  I think they're including passat and tiguan this year unfortunately.

It's a performance road course rather than a track couse, but there is still a little on racing lines.  I've been going for the last few years and I credit it helping me avoid two very near accidents.  

Instructors are race drivers.

Google volkswagen driving experience.

[hugh]

Is the main draw card to these that you don't have to use your own car? 

[DJM]

Did a BMW Performance Driving day at PI.  Some slow boring cars.  Highlight was fast laps in an M3 V8.  Had a fantastic session behind the instructor who was pushing hard and coaching me via walkie talkie.  How they drive that hard while watching in the rear vision mirror....

I will say, going from a Audi R8 to a LMS car was like chalk and cheese though.  

at a track day in my GT2 road car, Audi had 2 X R8 LMS testing in my group ?.  Drove every lap looking in the mirror. I remember going down the straight checking mirrors, OK maintaining same gap (we were both doing 260-265 on straights) but at turn 1 Garth Tander came from nowhere, scared the shit out of me and zapped past and was gone.  A race car with aero and slicks (and a pro driver!) meant lap times 15 seconds faster......  He was doing 220 through turn 1 to my 180, astonishing.  Watch Lowndes he barely slow for turn 1:

Edited 20August, 2017 by DJM

[Oldmxnut]

He makes it look easy.  At end of the session they overlayed our best lap data with Craigs lap.  Comes down to corners and reaction times, no surprises there. But smooth.  Notice when his throttle bar goes on, it just builds perfectly smoothly and again braking, the same.  My acceleration lines conversely where all over the place. Too much, not enough..

But check out Stoners corner (no. 3 after the straight).  He accelerates from 2 and just keeps throttle 100% on all the way to 4... no backing off.  Also 7 and 8, just keeps accelerating.  Thats just skill and big kuhunas helped by good aero and tyres.  

But back to the driving school... again this is why if you get the chance / ($ question, is i think $6K) .. go for it.  

[Kid A]

Hi all

Quick question, was tossing up between Advanced Driver Training ($950 BYO car in November 2018) versus Porsche Sport Driving School ($1485 up in Mt Cotton, QLD, but everything's provided).

I'm just a casual driver, no prior experience other than one day this year at the VW Drive Day at Phillip Island (which was fun but quite tame).

Can anyone give a recommendation as to whether I should go for the Mt Cotton course or the Phillip Island? The pros/cons, so far as I can tell, are:

Phillip Island:
- Cheaper (though have to account for the fact that you're using your own car at your own risk)
- Simpler, for the most part. No need to book flights from Melbourne, accommodation, rental car etc.
- Get to drive my own car (981 Boxster S)
- Probably more track time overall

Mt Cotton:
- More expensive
- I think less track oriented (from what I can tell, there's more emphasis on skid-pans, slalom etc, which I don't mind)
- More casual - no risk, no worries
- Get to try out other Porsche models and also hot laps, etc

Any thoughts? I'm having trouble splitting the pair. I don't want to fork out for both, though I might end up doing so. I should note, I am keen to give my car (or an equivalent car) a blast at the track or on a course - I don't need to be out there doing laps all day, or anywhere near 10/10 intensity, but I'd like a little bit of lap time. The VW day was disappointing because we only got 4 laps around Phillip Island in total and the laps were very, very slow.

 

[DJM]

I did level 3 at PI last Thursday.  Surprisingly the instructors no longer ride in the car for safety reasons (I suppose you have to ask - would you get in with a novice/stranger in a car than will be doing 250-ish down the straight?). Luke youlden was the main guy with dean canto, Steve Owen and 1 other supercar driver instructing.  The day started with a track walk - we stopped at 4 corners and canto talked us through braking and turn in points and Steve Owen did a fast drive through  in a 991.2 to get a close up view.  Great to get a different perspective on the track.

They split us into 3 groups of about 12 cars, 15 minutes every hour, like a normal track day but more varied experience level with some guys who'd never been on track before so there were some mobile road blocks but you could ask to change groups if you felt you were faster.  I left early around 2:30 because it was bloody hot (dash showed 41.5 degrees at one stage!).  By early arvo, lots had left so they combined into 2 groups and basically 30m per hour so heaps of track time. They provided instruction from the pits or you could ask them to drive one of their cars and you follow them around or they would drive your car and you ride as passenger

ive done a lot of lapse there  in various cars but first time in the GT4so I was keen to see what it was capable of.  The best part was Steve Owen driving my car ...wow, much faster everywhere, much harder braking, much more patient waiting for front end grip before picking up the throttle and much quicker lap time.  I asked him to show me what it was capable of and he said they'd never do that because when I try to emulate him I'd crash.....so he was probably 90%. Yet again reminded me of the gulf between amateur and pro drivers.

i managed to pull 3s off my lap time in the next session by following his tips so it's well worth it to understand what your car is capable of.  The main difference was keeping the throttle absolutely pinned through Stoner and Hayshed at 200 plus, much easier when he's shown you it can be done comfortably within the limit.  Amazing.  

Everyone seemed to enjoy it.  For me it was really just a track day with some opportunity for tuition but not an instructor in car which I was a bit disappointed about.  It's a slightly more controlled environment so probably "safer" and without the heroes you sometimes get at track days who think they are racing for sheep stations (although we did have some clown in a 991 GT3 that used launch control to exit the pits for every session......?).  And a few less ars on track.   The instruction was good but not the same as having someone alongside when you drive as is often available at other track days.  I was given a voucher when I bought the car so I wasn't sure what it cost - sounds like $950 which is about 3 normal track days.  Not great value in that sense but far less daunting to try as your first track day with like minded enthusiasts.  If I wanted to track the GT4 again I'd just head along to a normal track day run by car clubs all year round.

i could take or leave the "hospitality" - they work hard on making you feel welcome and food was good but who cares, it's a track day!

[Kid A]

Thanks for the detailed feedback mate, that sounds like a great day. I assume there is no insurance you can buy that covers the ADT - i.e. you were using the car at your own risk? Also, besides basics like topping up fluids and checking tyre pressure, was there any prep/inspection you had to undergo for your car for it to be able to bused?
 

 

 

[neill]

Unfortunately, the in-car instruction is going to slowly phase out over time as getting insurance to do so is getting increasingly difficult. There are very few operations that can get it anymore and those that do are fighting pretty hard to keep it.

I work as the events manager at Qld Raceway and Tomas Mezera and co come out quite regularly, they would have to be the most professional outfit of all the track day providers we get. It is not uncommon to see drivers loose 10seconds or more from their times over the course of the day.

If you are looking for a track-focused driving session I personally would skip the first couple of levels as its really more of a skidpan/have a drive of other models sort of thing, even the level two they do here at QR really is a slalom, emergency braking, try one corner at a time sort of event. Once you get to level 3 and 4 where you are driving the GT3's and Cup cars then you are in the levels where you will learn some valuable skills for track work (if that's what you are chasing).

[TwoHeadsTas]

49 minutes ago, Kid A said:

Thanks for the detailed feedback mate, that sounds like a great day. I assume there is no insurance you can buy that covers the ADT - i.e. you were using the car at your own risk? Also, besides basics like topping up fluids and checking tyre pressure, was there any prep/inspection you had to undergo for your car for it to be able to bused?
 

 

 

Is that last word meant to be "used" or "abused"

[Kammo]

Did the Level 3 with DJM last week, it's almost three times the cost of the average PIARC day and for the cost of entry you get a few benefits.

1. Less cars with a bit more track time as DJM already pointed out.

2. Track walk with fly-by; you don't often get to do a track walk and they position you on Southern Loop, Siberia and Lukey Heights to have a look at the optimal lines.

3. Having a pro driver do a lap whilst you record their telemetry then overlay it onto your own; for me this was of value because I know where to hunt the extra time now.

4. LOL at yellow 991

It depends on where you're at with the journey, I'd say the level three BYO day provides diminishing returns but worthwhile if you were trying to narrow in on finding some extra time. 

I've done a couple of Audi days where you follow a lead car and how fast they drive is in response to how fast you drive, that was a pretty good format.

[DJM]

7 hours ago, Kid A said:

Thanks for the detailed feedback mate, that sounds like a great day. I assume there is no insurance you can buy that covers the ADT - i.e. you were using the car at your own risk? Also, besides basics like topping up fluids and checking tyre pressure, was there any prep/inspection you had to undergo for your car for it to be able to bused?

Yep no insurance.  Porsche letter said to get the car checked out prior.  To me that meant fill with fuel and check tyre pressures at San Remo ?

4 hours ago, Kammo said:

Did the Level 3 with DJM last week

 Aha didn’t realise you were a PFA lurker.  Good to catch up, might cross paths at another track day, next time I’ll be in the GT3 eating chicken cooker ?

PS my mate with the TTS says he knows you from Audi forum Back when you had your TTRS.  Small world.

[cafe_racer]

I'm looking to do the advanced driver training at phillip island, this is the one where you use your own car.  Was considering doing it in a '86 3.2 carrera.  Has anyone here done the ADT in a classic car?