UK Imports

[Sov]

Why does everyone turn their nose up at UK imports?

[tomo]

Rust 

[MFX]

For some crazy reason a lot of buyers are willing to pay a huge premium to get a piece of paper that says the car was Australian delivered. Rust is sometimes spouted as a reason but any imported car gets tarred with the same brush like RHD South African or Hong Kong delivered cars. 

I would always buy a car on condition first and if you have 2 identical condition cars but you can get one for 20% less because of the piece of paper you only see when you buy or sell the car says it is an import. Perfect. 

Both are just as good of an investment because if the 'Aussie' car goes up in value, so does the import. You know you will get 20% less than the Aussie car when you are done, and while you owned it you had the exact same experience with either car. 

Import for the win.

[Sov]

3 minutes ago, MFX said:

Import for the win.

Okay, next question ... what's the best way to go about sourcing an air-cooled from overseas?

[Fishcop]

Here's an example of "do your due diligence"

 

[smit2100]

1 hour ago, MFX said:

For some crazy reason a lot of buyers are willing to pay a huge premium to get a piece of paper that says the car was Australian delivered. Rust is sometimes spouted as a reason but any imported car gets tarred with the same brush like RHD South African or Hong Kong delivered cars. 

I would always buy a car on condition first and if you have 2 identical condition cars but you can get one for 20% less because of the piece of paper you only see when you buy or sell the car says it is an import. Perfect. 

Both are just as good of an investment because if the 'Aussie' car goes up in value, so does the import. You know you will get 20% less than the Aussie car when you are done, and while you owned it you had the exact same experience with either car. 

Import for the win.

I 'm with you.  I did a ppi on a uk imported 996 turbo rust bucket.   (supposedly)  The  northern suburbs indi said they see a lot more rust on the locally delivered  northern Sydney beaches garaged examples.  Something about salt apparently as an accelerant. 

[Mike D'Silva]

 

Here is a fairly well known thread about a New Zealander who bought a car from the UK after getting a ppi from a Porsche dealer. This doesn't mean ALL UK CARS ARE RUST BUCKETS!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/798211-porsche-approved-rusty-carrera-3-2-a.html

 

I agree with Jeff.. buy on condition. 

Why do you want to source one overseas? 

[GUT]

I have 2 UK cars, 1 Jap, 1 USA and 1 Oz.

All built in the the same place. Condition is key.

Oz delivered premium for the same car, same condition is pure madness.

[Sov]

8 hours ago, Fishcop said:

Here's an example of "do your due diligence"

Is due diligence not the case for any Porsche, regardless of origin?

8 hours ago, Mike D'Silva said:

Why do you want to source one overseas? 

I want to smash one around a race track and don't want to pay the sold-new-in-Aus premium.

[cafe_racer]

11 hours ago, the_sovereign_man said:

Okay, next question ... what's the best way to go about sourcing an air-cooled from overseas?

Didn't you just buy an Aust Del 996?  If so guess you answered your own question.

[Sov]

43 minutes ago, cafe_racer said:

Didn't you just buy an Aust Del 996?  If so guess you answered your own question.

I bought a 996 in the spec that I wanted that was within my budget and 40 minutes from my house. How does that answer my question "Why does everyone turn their nose up at UK imports?"

[Mike D'Silva]

3 hours ago, the_sovereign_man said:

 

I want to smash one around a race track and don't want to pay the sold-new-in-Aus premium.

haha I like that. I hope you can find one that's good enough to buy, and "bad" enough to keep the price down. I guess if it were me, I'd try to find a UK group/forum or two, make some friends, find out who is in the know, then lean on them to suss one out for you. Probably then get some sort of inspection done on the body to find out how much rot it has (if any).

If you are plannign to track it, I guess mechanicals are not too critical since you'd likely build your own motor and box, but a fairly sound body is more important?

Does it have to be RHD? There are some cheaper cars here in Aus. Not sure what price tag but sometimes you can pick something up for the 40-50k mark that is not too bad at all. 

[jakroo]

Personally, I think the stigma comes from the variances in the mid 80s etc for any cars that didn't have the Australian standards stamp on it.  At the time, personally importing a car was a way to transfer wealth from one country to another. It was very common to do this for the South Africa to Australia immigrant as the SA government prevented wealth leaking out of their country so that meant they couldn't move a large wad of cash but a personal asset like an expensive car (even better with a leather clad gold based door card or dash that wasn't declared) could do that.

Because it was essentially a cash equivalent for the immigrants they then needed to sell it once it was in the country.  The issue at the time was that the banks wouldn't lend on those vehicles not because they were South African or UK as such but because they didn't have the factory issued ADR stamp even though they might have met the standards. This meant resale became an issue and therefore people buying were either doing it with cash or paying well below the odds for essentially the same car.  Porsche, Mercedes were the most popular import then BMW and Ferrari after that.

In the mid 90s you could personally import a European car of your choice if you drove it over there while on an extended holiday. They too had a similar resale issue even though it was very unlikely that the car had been through a hellish time given it was yours straight from the factory.

In the more exotic landscape of the American (muscle and ute/truck), and Japanese (hi performance) the import car has been incredibly expensive and people still don't mind paying that premium despite the fact that the odometer is usually well south of what the real distance traveled has been.

Rust is an issue from any country. If you can get a vehicle that's been sitting in a paddock in central Australia for 30 years then that'd be your better option. No rain, no salt equals no rust.

I can remember looking at my first/second/third cars built in either Australia or Japan in the late 80s and early 90s and any of those originally in the beach areas (in my case Sydney's northern besides) were rust buckets and had a huge stigma attached to them. So it's not just cars from the UK that have these issues.

[tomo]

Yep you are onto it @jakroo in my case the stigma started  with the Jag imports nearly every  Jaguar you could find for decent money was a UK import and a rust bucket back in the day .

[Zelrik911]

12 hours ago, tomo said:

Rust 

I am old and experienced in this. With UK original cars, its more than just rust - its the sub-standard repairs that are done to rusty and crashed cars to tart them up and sell them off to unsuspecting suckers. If an UK  seller can palm a shite-heap off to the colonies, that's a double bonus as there is practically no come back, & they have bragging rights in the pub for decades!.

Plus, with cars we here treat with a sort of reverence, they dont care as there are plenty more around compared with Au.

Obviously the above is not a 100% true but so many of us have been burned that the distrust is high. You cannot even trust well regarded  UK firms with good reputations.

On the other side, I have had good experiences with ex US cars from Southern States with similar weather to here and no hidden Arthur Daley repairs.

 

 

[Sov]

15 minutes ago, mrar said:

Good luck with your search.

Wow.

What's the purpose of the photo?

[LeeM]

 It's just the stigma attached to UK cars by those who have either experienced a dodgy car they've bought, Joe Bloggs told them a story, or they're just purists who will only buy an Aussie delivered car. 

 Theres been horror stories when people have thought they're buying a cheap car from the UK, only to have to spend a shitload of money fixing it (I know one personally who ended up spending a LOT more than the original purchase price to repair a car he was told was mint, yet was the exact opposite), and theres also those who have bought well and never had a problem, so it's luck of the draw I s'pose.

 If you want a cheaper Porsche to thrash around, an import is the best way to go, yet just be aware you may have to spend a few dollars if you don't check it out thoroughly. I also wouldn't trust anyone overseas if you're looking to import one yourself, as they just want your cash. Unless you have a RELIABLE source to check a car out, have a spare few grand to fix a few problems that may arise 

 

[Fishcop]

I don't see point of the discussion.  It's been hashed out ad nauseum on nearly every Aussie car forum.

There is a bunch of owners who swear by imports - cool, I'm a fan of primarily enjoying a car and if an import gets you behind the wheel - so much the better.  But don't bitch when you can't unload it for what an AU delivered car gets. 

Those of us that have a pretty long history with the marque worked out long ago that if you plan on trying to keep depreciation down or indeed keep and maintain value, you stone up the "premium" for an Australian delivered car.  Next tier down are the rarities and low-production numbered cars (the older S cars etc...) which may well be overseas sourced cars.  It's been like this for 40 years and I doubt it's going to change soon.

If you want a track pig, go for it - though I'd be inclined to buy what someone has already built and refine rather than go from scratch.

14 hours ago, the_sovereign_man said:

Okay, next question ... what's the best way to go about sourcing an air-cooled from overseas?

Traditionally you lied to your wife and took her on a "holiday" where you just happened to located the car of your dreams.  You'd eyeball it, get a PPI done with you present and be totally comfortable about your purchase.  You then get a local friend or pay an agent to ship it home and keep enjoying your holiday.

Inability to travel makes this all super hard now and a huge amount of trust is required.  I'd start with the bigger forums (Early S, Pelican, DDK) and see what's out there - you may be better going with a reputable dealer with a good reputation.  There's normally someone on the forums happy to go take a look at a car for you (as we would here) and give an unbiased opinion or take photos of what the dealer won't.

[3legs]

I was one of the lucky ones. My old 930 was a UK import and didn't have a single spot of rust on it. 

Ok it only spent 3 years in the UK before it was imported in 1984 but even when I bought it back in 2003 it still had no rust. A credit to the previous owner(s).

[Zelrik911]

24 minutes ago, 3legs said:

I was one of the lucky ones. My old 930 was a UK import and didn't have a single spot of rust on it. 

Ok it only spent 3 years in the UK before it was imported in 1984 but even when I bought it back in 2003 it still had no rust. A credit to the previous owner(s).

If you are buying from O/S you must remember when 911 bodies were galvanised during production, as that provides SOME protection if originality is maintained. But if there is an accident/bingle & bodywork then protection is lost. UK owners know this well & will flog off duds ASAP.

Early G model P cars had no galvanising - and that picture above with a resto space frame is probably an early car -   no gal.

Protection gradually started in mid '70s & moved upwards until they were fully gal. dipped. I have forgotten the exact dates, the good 930 above was likely gal protected.

[tomo]

30 minutes ago, Zelrik911 said:

If you are buying from O/S you must remember when 911 bodies were galvanised during production, as that provides SOME protection if originality is maintained. But if there is an accident/bingle & bodywork then protection is lost. UK owners know this well & will flog off duds ASAP.

Early G model P cars had no galvanising - and that picture above with a resto space frame is probably an early car -   no gal.

Protection gradually started in mid '70s & moved upwards until they were fully gal. dipped. I have forgotten the exact dates, the good 930 above was likely gal protected.

I think 76 was the first  year of full Gal , And a 6 year Warranty. 

[Sov]

2 hours ago, Fishcop said:

Traditionally you lied to your wife and took her on a "holiday" where you just happened to located the car of your dreams.

Gave me a chuckle. This is how my father-in-law sourced his boat.

[edgy]

On 07/08/2021 at 20:50, the_sovereign_man said:

Why does everyone turn their nose up at UK imports?

Its probably the accent... 

[Coastr]

The uk is a wet country full of muddy narrow roads that get salted in the winter.  Garaging is rare, especially in urban areas. 
 

what a uk buyer would consider ‘ok rust’ would be cut up for spares here or in the USA.

Watch this video of a uk car and tell me you want a uk car.  Exceptions do exist, some cars were cherished and garages.  Those ones are lovely with little UV damage.  The rest are suspicious 

 

 

[WGA]

26 minutes ago, Coastr said:

The uk is a wet country full of muddy narrow roads that get salted in the winter.  Garaging is rare, especially in urban areas. 
 

what a uk buyer would consider ‘ok rust’ would be cut up for spares here or in the USA.

Watch this video of a uk car and tell me you want a uk car.  Exceptions do exist, some cars were cherished and garages.  Those ones are lovely with little UV damage.  The rest are suspicious 

 

 

Don't know if you have ever lived in the UK but I have. During that time I inspected a bunch of pre-90 911s. Many were in excellent condition. Some were rubbish...it's just the same in Australia. There is a reason the car in this video is very cheap. It's a rubbish example.

As with all old 911s, when buying one, its all about getting a good PPI to sort out the wheat from the chaff. IMHO, the level of bias against UK cars is entirely unjustified.